Finished: 05 AM Sat 22 Jun 13 UTC
MUTE 2 DAYS
2 days /phase
Pot: 140 D - Autumn, 1907, Finished
Classic, Public messaging only, Survivors-Win Scoring
1 excused missed turn
Game drawn
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: Let me explain my actions. I wanted to be sure that Kaiser can't break the stalemate by entering North Africa - that's all.
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: Number of terretories is not the issue as a draw would anyway split equal. However, a solo win is 18 SC's, germany will be at 17, so clearly we need to ensure the dismissal of france in a way germany does not get a chance at this. If germany chooses to stay at gal, I do not see a way to take Iberia without germany having the possibility to act against his words and stab us for a solo. (unless france cd's of course) If he is honest about doing it, he will leave gas because even with a fleet in the gulf we can still only attack pie with 1 support, and bur provides one supporthold.

Germany is a good player, far to good to count wrong on such basic counting, therefore I do not see anyother reason he stays in gas than wanting to launch a stab at spain when on 17 SC's trying for a solo.
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: Ah, lot's of diplomatic activity. For me to allow Turcish forces in Warsaw would be to break the stalemate. I agree with Turkey, as we have no real experience of how well each others word holds in these matters I want to keep the stalemate line.
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: What about my action plan proposal?
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: I do not want warsaw, germany will hold 4 units around it making it impossible to hold.
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: Due to the Italian moves this season I could take Spain, but since it would destabilze my line I will not do so.
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: :)
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: However it is possible to take Iberia without me having a chance of taking it
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: Please offer your course of action :)
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: Move a fleet to GoL and WM (fastest and safest for you to move WM->GoL and Tun->WM with NA support.
Next season cut MidA and Mar potential supports with NA and Pie, while supporting WM to Spa with GoL. The fleet currently in Ionian replaces WM/bounces MidA.
I will then have Mar, Gas and MidA, while you have Pie, Spa, GoL, NA and WM (unless I try something funny).
Either way WM will not be necessary for your defence: NA and Pie can cut MidA and Mar support while GoL supports Spa.
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: Good enough for me, but if France CD's after this turn we might as well draw immediately :)
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: And now that I think of it you can't take Por without fear of me cheating, but not to worry; I will not take Moscow. Turkey will move Rum to Sev to Support it. Then Turkey (now holding Spain will support me to Por.
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: And Iberia is taken.
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: Though I suspect France will CD before we need to go through all that.
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: Ok, so there is no trust around here to organize the draw quickly?...
My experience says that when a person promise something - (s)he will probably do that - with rare exceptions. I plays this game always with that idea on mind and only once somebody really stabbed me seriously.
In a way, I have an impression that all three of us are normal, ordinary people that can keep their word, so I promise - from my side that I will respect any plan that leads toward three-side draw.
If both of you make a same promise, there is no real reason not to trust each other.
What I have suggested is pretty "safe". If Kaiser wants to take Moscow now, than he can't keep Warsaw. On the other side, I expect Kaiser to give me support - if he says he will, and I can promise that I'm going to give him support for Portugal after that.
The only question is has everybody accepted the draw solution; if we have - than everything is ok.
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: But I don't insist on "my" scenario; I would like to hear others as well.
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: I vote for germanys
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: Oh, I could try to take Moscow, and if I played it safe I wouldn't lose anything. If I supported with St.P and Liv and Turkey guessed I was doing that things could get ugly.
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: We've agreed to draw and I will keep my word, whatever happens. If I really wanted to insist on winning I could just wait it out, the chance of one of you going NMR is about double that of mine...
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: If you really trust me you can move to Spain: MidA has nothing else to do so I'm supporting you. Though I don't think Turkey would like it if you take that chance.
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: Oh, and how could I have missed this: "Germany is a good player" I'm flattered :)
"far to good to count wrong on such basic counting, therefore I do not see anyother reason he stays in gas than wanting to launch a stab at spain when on 17 SC's trying for a solo." At the moment I don't need it, but once you have Spain you'll have 3 neighbours of Marseilles.
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: So, should I attack Spain then? Sultan, are you going to take Warsaw? And Kaiser, are you going to take Moscow?
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: West med to gol. Tunis to west med. NA support tunis to med. Vienna hold boh and pie hit mar. Then we'll know if kaiser is sincere
17 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: And if he is not, and takes Spain from MAO?... But never mind... if he wins, I won't get too less points...
Ok, I am playing what you asked me to.
18 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: I could solo by Mar->Spa (sup Gas), MidA->WM
and guessing correctly wether Ukr supports Mos or Gal->War OR didn't replace Sev with Rum OR guessed correcly wether Turkey would the next turn try to keep War or retake Mosc.
18 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: Crap, was hoping you didn't see that. That was the direct concequence of Italy moving the fleets like he did last turn :( We'll see if you hold your word then of accepting a draw or if you go for the solo like I suspected.
18 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: And the next turn I'd also have to guess wether you're going for Marseille or Spain. I think I would've had about 70% chance of victory, and even if I didn't win I think we'd still have had a stalemate.
If we hadn't already agreed to draw I'd go for solo, but since we have I won't.
18 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: You made 2 mistakes that would've likely granted me a victory if I wouldn't have agreed to draw. The first was moving BS to Sev instead of convoying Bul, which would've allowed you to at least support Mosc against any attack, the second was Italys move away from Gol.
18 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: Fair point on BS/Bul, I shall make a note of this behind my ear and try to play better next time :) :)
18 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: Ok, guys... now when we know that Kaiser can win and doesn't want, can we think how to finish the game asap with draw? I still think my scenario is the fastest...
18 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: The fastest will be to draw after this turn in 1 day 1 hr when france CD's :)
18 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: So, should I play in a way you asked me to?
18 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: Or you have now some other scenario for me?
18 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: The moves the kaiser suggested and I agreed would be better :)
18 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: Guys, I've lost you both and I have to confess that this game is totally new experience for me; because of my lack of experience in public messaging games and in such situations in general.
So, I wouldn't like to ruin something and prolong the game for few years more; tell me, please, what I'm suppose to play particularly in this tricky situation and I will play it; I can't follow you anymore...
18 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: West med to gol. Tunis to west med. NA support tunis to med. Vienna hold boh and pie hit mar.
18 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: Take the exersice after the game to run through the chat and follow our strain of thoughts :)
18 Jun 13 UTC Spring, 1907: That's what I had already played... I thought you think I should play something Kaiser's suggested...
So, I'm done.
19 Jun 13 UTC The last one to draw remember to check to see some sneaky bastard hasn't taken over one of the anarchist territories to get in on the draw :)
19 Jun 13 UTC Does it seem only to me that we haven't done anything now and that we've just lost the move?...
19 Jun 13 UTC Yes.
19 Jun 13 UTC My opinion of you increased quite a bit there germany. Italy hit draw and we avhieved a threeway
19 Jun 13 UTC And?... What are we going to do?...
19 Jun 13 UTC Draw
19 Jun 13 UTC Five sides? Isn't it too much?
19 Jun 13 UTC two have left, it will only draw with the remaining three :)
19 Jun 13 UTC O, really... Than we don't have anything to wait for...
19 Jun 13 UTC Correct. Good game guys! I for one will go over these rounds move by move later to assess if it could have been played better from my side. (like convoy bul-sev)
19 Jun 13 UTC So, looking on the our points - it seems the whole game has been flowing pretty logical. Thank you everybody, especially Sultan and Kaiser! See you in another life! :o)
20 Jun 13 UTC Thanks for the good game.

Start Backward Open large map Forward End

Germany
Gtlblx (971 D)
Drawn. Bet: 20 D, won: 47 D
16 supply-centers, 15 units
Turkey
RaymondNordahl (1132 D)
Drawn. Bet: 20 D, won: 47 D
8 supply-centers, 8 units
Italy
chass (1540 D)
Drawn. Bet: 20 D, won: 47 D
7 supply-centers, 7 units
France
Dessard (156 D)
Resigned. Bet: 20 D
2 supply-centers, 2 units
Russia
wooferbird (100 D)
Resigned. Bet: 20 D
1 supply-centers, 1 units
Austria
GomJabbar (213 D)
Defeated. Bet: 20 D
England
gipsss (100 D)
Defeated. Bet: 20 D
Civil Disorders
GomJabbar (213 D)Austria (Spring, 1905) with 1 centres.
wooferbird (100 D)Russia (Spring, 1906) with 4 centres.
Dessard (156 D)France (Spring, 1907) with 2 centres.
Archive: Orders - Maps - Messages