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Finished: 01 PM Sun 14 Oct 12 UTC
Euro Gunboat-8
18 hours /phase
Pot: 105 D - Spring, 1907, Finished
Classic, Public messaging only, Anonymous players, Survivors-Win Scoring
1 excused missed turn
Game drawn
04 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1902: France, good. I hope we can keep peace between our two nations.

England I am curious of your intentions. I hope you don't mind my fleets off my own coast, it's just a defensive measure, however, I know that we share a sea at Skagerrak and would be willing to let you control that sea if you wish.

Russia, I have no wish for a war with you, but you'd understand if I put troops on my border since you seem to invade every nation close to you.
04 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1902: Germany, what's your aim with the fleet in Hel? I'm confused about your intentions.
04 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1902: Whispers to England: So is he!
04 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1902: England, it was a defensive move because to prevent someone else from owning it. if I was going to attack you, I would have moved Keil to Hel so both units could push at the North Sea, but as you can see, I didn't do that.
05 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1902: Denmark would be a more strategically important location instead of Hel, still allowing one to push into North Sea together with holland and at the same time, can also push into Sweden with Baltic Sea. Good choice Germany
05 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1902: Oh well......first out. But Italy will be close behind....kinda the usual result when Italy attacks Austria early.
06 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1903: Germany, would you be willing to bounce Livonia and Findland?
06 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1903: sure
07 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1903: sorry england, had to save berlin
07 Oct 12 UTC Spring, 1904: Understandable! I hope you will try the same thing this spring.
08 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1904: France, I thought you were going to attack munich last turn, that's why I went to English Channel. I'll move back to belg this turn since you didn't show aggression.
09 Oct 12 UTC Spring, 1905: Hey Germany, I mistakenly built a fleet. Can I send the Norwegian fleet into Sweden and you destroy it in the fall?
09 Oct 12 UTC Spring, 1905: sure
09 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1905: England can you hit moscow?
09 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1905: England, I don't know why you need to attack me furthermore...I can understand that you get st. peterburg as it is one of the centre along the coast
with so many fleet, it is unwise to attack me as all of my centre is inland...keep on attack me will only let germeny grow up and you cant get much
Moreover...i never attack you and no any so-called "defensive move" to you...I hope that I can keep friendly to you as I did not have fleet to betray you
of coz...my main purpose is to save myself...

You can get 2 centre in this year with my support hold to sweden and movement to denmark...see if you have any interest

I am not good in english...hope you can understand what I talk...
09 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1905: Your English is fine! I am just looking for the best options.
09 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1905: i have support hold sweden...just up to your decision
09 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1905: England, I'll let you keep Sweden if you bounce Moscow this turn.

Just imagine what would happen if you do betray me. I pull back on my eastern front and head for you. Meanwhile Russia devours me since he and Turkey are working together, and italy is dying to France right now, I am the only thing in Russias path.

So maybe I win the war versus us Which is very bad for you. Or maybe you win but most of my centers goes to Russia since I dont defend myself versus him and come straight at you. That's not good for you either.
09 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1905: Germany, I will bounce Moscow for Sweden.
09 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1905: i think it is the best option if I am england...you can get 2 centres in one year...instead of getting st.persburg with 3 army in 2 years due to germany betray you...although it is understoodable that he will lose berlin...I think he can reject your request instead of telling lies
09 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1905: i am not good in english and did not have so many explaination as you
i think england can get 3-4 centres from you and I get 2-3 centres from you...if he keep on attack me...you can get most from me and 1-2 centres from me for englnad as he did not have any army
09 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1905: turkey work with me because he know that he will fall also if i fall...i just gamble disband the fleet in rumania...btw i think it is better to lose land to turkey instead of germany as I think turkey is more reliable
09 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1905: to turkey...you can get rumania anytime but i dont think it is a good timing to you
09 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1905: I know that if you start to fall Turkey will move on in and take more from you. You're still the leader in this game and were very aggressive towards Austria. I normally would have stayed out but going unchecked you are to powerful.

I don;t mind having a draw. Check my record, I like draws. England and France I think we can draw this game, and if turkey works with us, we could even have a 4 way draw.
09 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1905: If you think i am aggressive towards austria...i don't know why you did not help him...you are also very aggressive towards me...um...dont know what you want to carry out
09 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1905: anyway...i support hold sweden and do not want to have too much explaination for my action
10 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1905: I will not move into Russia at this stage. Of course together with England and Germany, we can finish Russia in a few years. But in the current situation that both England and me only having a single army, most of the Russian centers would go to Germany's hand. England can mostly get Moscow and i can mostly get serbia and rumania while all others are likely German's.
In this way we are just supporting the growth of an ultra-strong Germany and invite him to turn against us after Russia's death.
I had one of the weakest opening in this game and do not have much choice other than keeping peace with Russia, and Russia has been a trustful partner since the start despite he can easily take over my centers
I have no reason to turn against him at this critical stage
I agree with a draw as everyone has been doing a great work and worth a share of their bet
10 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1905: It's a time when everyone having a similar size of either 6 or 7 centers, and should be a time for us to think about the future development of our game
It's not easy for England Germany and France keeping peace till the end of the game, probably due to geographical reason and the disadvantage of France and England to expand into the east with a strong Germany in between
I should be in a relative advantage since most players around me are falling eg Austria, Italy and maybe Russia, but I think it's more fair to voice out what I think for better consideration of each and every player in this turn point of the game
I would agree with a draw and here I place my vote
10 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1905: Once Italy is gone (sorry Italy)? I could agree to that.
10 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1905: I don't see how I am the super strong one here. If anything I am the weakest considering who is on my sides. To my north is a nation of 6th strenght, to my west is a nation of 7 strength, to my east and south is a nation of 7 strength... and I am only a 7 strength nation.

However, If everyone wants to draw, who am I to stop it.
10 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1905: IF anything, I am impressed that we, England, France and Germany... have been able to not backstab each other for so long. England has had many opportunities to betray me, as has France, and I've had a few chances to hurt them myself, but we stay together strong, so I will vote however they vote. If they want to draw it then we can do that. If not, the three of us can continue working together
10 Oct 12 UTC Spring, 1906: I would keep playing for a while. I can stop Turkey on Med and you England and Germany have adventage over Russia. We 3 can win this map. If they play good and block us, so we can draw then.
10 Oct 12 UTC Spring, 1906: Germany, let me know what your plans for Russia are. I would like support into Moscow if possible (to keep lanes of advance open) but might be impossible until you take Ukraine.
10 Oct 12 UTC Spring, 1906: If france is suggesting to eliminate Russia then me
Then I should be helping Russia to hold, and hope Russia would try support me if available to help defending the line
10 Oct 12 UTC Spring, 1906: England, If you want to move Swed to Gulf of B
Nor -> Swed
Convo Edi -> Norway
and bounce moscow...
that might be the best choice.

I don't want to tell my orders since he could mess them up
10 Oct 12 UTC Spring, 1906: Turkey. If you help us dissolve Russia We could draw. If you don't then we'll probably still win eventually and we won't share the victory with you
10 Oct 12 UTC Spring, 1906: Turkey. if they draw with u, it will be a good option to u...i dont mind as i known i must fall even with your help...anyway thank you very much
10 Oct 12 UTC Spring, 1906: Turkey. if they draw with u, it will be a good option to u...i dont mind as i known i must fall even with your help...anyway thank you very much
11 Oct 12 UTC Spring, 1906: Thx Russia for your good map reading
It's fun to try achieving some target and I will not turn again you
Hope we can hold the line and if you could spare, please kindly support my Venice for one more turn from Trieste. Your Vienna should be safe from Budapest support
11 Oct 12 UTC Spring, 1906: o...thx turkey and italy...
yeah...bingo...no problem i will support venice
11 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1906: oh Russia, sorry I miscalculated
I can support Venice myself and please feel free to use your Trieste army at your own wish
I will ask for help if needed ;)
11 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1906: Germany, are you staying in Livonia?
11 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1906: Do you want me to move? I can if you want but currently I am staying there
11 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1906: Please do! I will try to put another army in place in Livonia, to exert pressure inland.
11 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1906: Ok well now Russia may move moscow into Liv to bounce you. If we leave it open, you could take moscow...

But now I just said that and he can read it... so do what you want I'll not be in liv this turn
11 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1906: OK, I will say no more for now
12 Oct 12 UTC Autumn, 1906: dangit! misorder! I must have refreshed the page or something and not saved orders.
13 Oct 12 UTC i really need more armies not navies. England, take two of my cities this year. I'll get rid of 2 of my navies and the following year I'll take the cities back to get armies. This is going to be a long fight anyway
13 Oct 12 UTC Dear all, I believe its a time to call an end to the fight and draw it altogether
Everyone has done a great job in the game

Even France convoy his Tunis army to Pie this turn and NAfrica fleet move to Tunis
He will not be able to break into Venice or Ionian Sea
Similarly, Germany and England will be able to get Warsaw and then maybe Galicia+Moscow with their existing 5 army, but not further more even they have converted all their fleet into army

We will reach the Stalemate line (Ion-Nap-Rom-Ven-Tri-Vie-Bud-Rum-Sev)
One cannot break through into the 14 centers this Statemate line holds

Great work everyone and please reconsider a draw
Unless either one of Germany / England / France can get 18 centers out of those 20 outside the Stalemate line to win the game
Otherwise this game will be another classical East VS West draw
13 Oct 12 UTC Agree with Turkey; if game continue, Germany I will do that.

Start Backward Open large map Forward End

Turkey
bary (218 D)
Drawn. Bet: 15 D, won: 21 D
8 supply-centers, 8 units
Russia
XO (122 D)
Drawn. Bet: 15 D, won: 21 D
8 supply-centers, 8 units
England
ckroberts (3548 D)
Drawn. Bet: 15 D, won: 21 D
6 supply-centers, 6 units
France
quarryman (5100 D)
Drawn. Bet: 15 D, won: 21 D
6 supply-centers, 6 units
Germany
Drawn. Bet: 15 D, won: 21 D
6 supply-centers, 6 units
Italy
poko (100 D)
Defeated. Bet: 15 D
Austria
Creigh (2610 D (G))
Defeated. Bet: 15 D
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