She was your president twenty years ago. Old political farts love to hog attention like this, especially when they have nothing to lose any more.

The custom for former US presidents is to continune using the title president even after their term is complete.

But she didn't become an old fart upon leaving the presidency, she took a job at the UN and worked for human rights. And she continues to use her voice self-lessly promoting humanity's best interests.

USA is just a madhouse for the chronically insane... What did you expect ora?

better medical care for the chronically insane?

"she took a job at the UN and worked for human rights"

It's called a sinecure.

Zmaj, your perspective you'll be improved by being a refugee for a time. The level of cruelty and malice among conservatives never ceases to amaze

A refugee? Like you, you mean? Ogion will share his experiences with us... his hard, hard experiences... He worked in a coal mine since he was 8... sodomized by conservatives day and night...

What is it you say?! You haven't been a refugee? You... you had a normal life despite all those conservative ghouls around you? How did you escape their clutches?!

BTW how is that refugee child you adopted?

The difference is I don't callously make light of their situation and scoff at institutions like the UNHCR. You are the one who doesn't have an ounce of compassion for others in your whole being, (but no doubt think of yourself and a great Christian).

And actually, my dad was a refugee who had the sense to settle in California and my mom got out of conservative Dumbfuckistan as soon as she was old enough, to answer your question.

Trump has always been a churlish rogue. Yay.

I feel your pain, brother Ogion. Having to say your mother is Dumbfuckistani must be a heavy cross to bear through life. Oh I'm sorry, did I say cross? I meant a crescent moon. Is that bad too? Then anything else that doesn't offend you, ok?

@Zmaj: you may not care about her work, but some people did: "She extended her intended single four-year term by a year to preside over the World Conference against Racism 2001 in Durban, South Africa; the conference proved controversial, and under continuing pressure from the US, Robinson resigned her post in September 2002."

So she pissed off Americans enough that they pushed her out of her job as IN commissioner for human rights. I wonder if it was because she kept trying to actually get shit done, ie she cared.

Infact, she had to resign early from being the President of Ireland to take the job in the first place (resigning in sept of her final year, instead of dec, which caused some scandal locally, though i don't remember it).

No matter what, you can't say she didn't care. She may not have been able to transform the world (cause the IS forced her to stand down) but you can't say she didn't try! (And you're a cynical asshat for suggesting so.)

Of course, she did something to alleviate suffering in the world. That's why Zmaj and conservatives are so dismissive

Well she tried, she did say she 'received too little support from UN member states in carrying out her mandate.'

https://www.rferl.org/a/1096001.html

It is entirely possible that she didn't achieve as much as she would have liked.

I know you want to hear it, orathaic, so I'll say it in her name:

"I thank orathaic from the bottom of my heart for standing up for me. Mary Robinson."

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-europe-migrants-germany-logistics-ins-idUSKCN0RY0E420151004

A quick note on Refugees for Germany specifically:

"The interior ministry reckons almost a third of migrants who say they are Syrian are not actually from the country."

there is a vast difference between fleeing a civil war, and simply getting a free pass into an economically superior country. as it stands, the refugee crisis is a nightmare not only because of the people who are in trouble, but also because of the people who are pushing them back in line to try to get into western nations as well (you know, the vile, racist western nations)

And onto the Paris accords

1. the left's attack on Nuclear power has held us back from not only cleaner energy, but also more economically beneficial energy

https://www.oecd-nea.org/nea-news/2011/29-2/nea-news-29-2-load-following-e.pdf

There has been less favorability recently, but after Fukushima everyone dropped a bit Republicans included

http://www.gallup.com/poll/190064/first-time-majority-oppose-nuclear-energy.aspx

Meanwhile the USA is blamed for being a mass contributor to climate change, and while we are releasing lots of Carbon Dioxide into the atmosphere, we're at our lowest emissions in decades.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/progress-u-s-carbon-emissions-decline/

now there's still work to be done, but we must also consider that the USA has a MUCH faster population growth rate than all of Europe, who famously dropped into negative growth rate around 2000. meanwhile they're pumping in hundreds of billions of dollars for alternative energy subsidies

https://ec.europa.eu/energy/sites/ener/files/documents/ECOFYS%202014%20Subsidies%20and%20costs%20of%20EU%20energy_11_Nov.pdf

while we are much more benign in this regard. in fact, Germany's carbon emissions have been problematic with more renewables, as they reach max limits on generator capacity, they actually saw Carbon emissions increase for parts of 2015

https://www.umweltbundesamt.de/sites/default/files/medien/478/dokumente/pi-2016-09_uba-emissionsdaten_fuer_2015_zeigen_notwendigkeit_fuer_konsequente_umsetzung_des_aktionsprogramms_klimaschutz_2020.pdf

in fact, overall decline isn't going as well as they'd like. turns out purposefully destroying Nuclear energy to accommodate renewables is like kick down a ladder then trying to jump onto a roof. perhaps if the green movement weren't so science-denier-y and technologically regressive about Nuclear we wouldn't even have global warming in the first place.

We have global warming because cheap energy was cheap in the first place, surface coal and easily accessible oil/gas were amazing sources of energy; stores of millions of years worth of solar energy, released by humans in a tiny fraction of that time. (and unfortunately released as Carbon Dioxide, which is next to impossible to return underground/recapture...).

That energy meant we could do things which were not limited by manpower or horse-power. For the first time in human history, we could amplify our energy usage (ok, i ignore water mills, and wind mills, used for milling grain for hundreds of years). I was the most sensible thing to do. The last leap in energy capture and usage was when we first started farming plants and animals, domesticating both allowed us to build the first cities, and to specialise our labour forces.

What have we done with the bonanza of energy coal/oil/gas have given us?

Increased the human population 9-fold in 200 years.

The greatest story about population explosion is "The Deadly Mission of Phineas Snodgrass" by Frederik Pohl. You can read it here in its original 1962 edition (it has less than four pages):

http://galacticjourney.org/stories/Galaxy_v20n05_1962-06.pdf

Or you can listen to it here:

https://www.podomatic.com/podcasts/aboutsf/episodes/2011-10-26T06_48_45-07_00

It's a masterful take on the overpopulation paranoia. By the way, have you noticed the huge role played by paranoia even in our "enlightened" times? While phenomena like global warming or patriotism are real, most of the discussions about them are pure paranoia.

Much of the "discussion" of climate change isn't paranoia, it is ignorant delusion that scientists have to cut through.

Actually, if you think population hasn't had dramatic negative impacts, you just aren't paying attention, frankly.

Don't get me started on the negative impacts of population, Ogion. Those refugees flooding California are really a huge problem. What do you think should be done about it?

Overpopulation and inflation and starvation
And the crazy politicians!

I propose shipping them all back home to the south and midwest. Let them handle them

Hey now, Ogion. California is where people have their Eureka! moments. We exist so people can come here from conservative parts of the country to dream their American Dream. I'm one of them having spent many years in Ohio and Missouri prior.

Hillary ran a terrible campaign in 2016. The Presidency was hers to lose, and she did. Californians return to other states and take our values with them. It's all good.

https://www.redfin.com/blog/2017/04/movement-out-of-california-driver-of-u-s-migration.html

Ogion, you forgot shipping your mom back to Dumbfuckistan and your daddy to wherever he came from.

Back the fuck off Zmaj

DemonOverlord, it wouldn't hurt you to read the discussion and understand the context before throwing emotional comments around. Provided you're not too lazy for that, of course.

+1

I did read it, unfortunately.

Then you didn't understand it. It was Ogion who said his father was a refugee and who called his mother's homeland Dumbfuckistan. When I asked him how he would resolve the issue of refugees in California, he proposed to ship them all back home, obviously forgetting it would apply to his parents too.

It just goes to show that thoughtless people never apply their own rules to themselves.

Good points Zmaj

Thank you. I'm glad someone's been paying attention.

I don't think Ogion was advocating shipping refugees back home. I think he was referring to people from the US. You know you're wrong when ND is your yes man

No problem.

No, actually, I'd ship just the ones from the Midwest home, but as Jeff points out, that's not a good plan, because the smart people leave and the brain drain makes us a lot richer. I realize that conservatives were big fans of shipping refugees back to Nazi Germany, but again, he's not from the Midwest, so that wouldn't apply under my "travel ban" no, I mean, err, pause....

;)

The biggest issue though with liberal minded folks flocking to the much better coasts is that we still have this electoral college thing which means individual states matter and that medium sized states matter most (which Hillary conveniently ignored).

Yeah well you also have liberal minded people that still live in those states that are just supposed to shrug and sigh when their vote doesn't actually count *cough* me *cough* so it's not hard to understand why we may not exactly be motivated to stay.

This thread needs a chill pill. Stop making shit personal. Stop going after families. Stop calling some mysterious nation "Dumbfuckistan." And no, I don't care who said what first.

"This thread needs a chill pill."

I think you need one.

"Stop going after families."

Are you being serious or just mod-trolling?

"And no, I don't care who said what first."

The perks of a mod censor. He doesn't need to care. He can just block.

Overpopulation? Japan fell under one million annual births for the first time since 1899.
Respect for life. A doctor in holland euthenized a seventy-eight year old nun who didn't want to die that way but let her cancer take its course. The Dutch courts sided with the doctor, bloodsuckers. Open the floodgates, break the dykes. Wipe the Netherlands off the map

Well, now bo_sox is attacking off-forum. For the benefit of the community, I'll post his e-mail here:

"Hi Zmaj,

In http://webdiplomacy.net/forum.php?viewthread=1485012, you have engaged in unacceptable personal attacks against Ogion and his family. The continuation of these attacks will result in a silence.

This is an official warning."

When you are unable to say anything remotely sensible (attacks against Ogion and his family?), you get official. The tactic of governments everywhere.

Well, censor? How about you explain things to me? Officially, I mean. How exactly do you expect me to continue an attack I never made?

https://xkcd.com/386/

@Bo

earlier in the thread Ogion referred to them as coming from dumbfuckistan, and he hasn't directly complained about that to Zmaj since from what I've seen

Aaaaawwww, crikey Zmaj, stop whining, grow a pear (LoL) you "skate way out on thin ice and land in hot water" (LoL). You was naughty and got smacked. Toughen up sweetypie, don't try and blame BoSox, cop it sweet and move on.

I can believe that Ogion came from DFaStan.

Then again perhaps he is just Satan.