Choosing a ring together may well get a better ring (or not, as the case may be) but you sacrifice a lot by doing so. The man doesn't get to enjoy the hunt as much, nor experience the heady mix of emotions (a combination of panic and excitement) as he wonders whether she's going to like it. For her part woman loses out on any surprise element.

All depends on how you prefer to live life

We chose the rings together as well. Like I said before, we do basically everything together, but if she's into materialism and you are not, then it's not going to work very well. I am talking to people who are not materialistic.

I think some of the symbolism around marriage is understandable, if not appropriate. The marriage symbolizes your relationship and it's serious long-term quality.

Something like a wedding ring is a physical symbol of your end of the marriage. It's a physical reminder of the choice you made, etc.

I can understand the reaction against the traditions of marriage and so on because so often we are conditioned to react against the past, but often some of these traditions can have real meaning for us in the present day. I wouldn't disparage someone who derives such meaning.

For instance, earlier someone seemed to think that I wanted to get married because of social pressure because "that's just what's done." But that's not really it. I plan to defy my parents plenty enough to where not getting married would be just one more thing. And no one else really pressures me to get married. So it's not that.

I want it mostly because it makes sense to me and I like the idea of it. If you have the urge to spend your whole life with one sexual partner, I am much more in tune with the idea of putting that out there verbally to her and to others and having it reciprocated.

I don't think long-term unmarried cohabitators are somehow doing it wrong, but it would be uncomfortable for me. A marriage is, essentially, in my view, an escalation of the relationship. It's hard to get out of a marriage for a reason, just as it's harder to move out than it is to simply break up if you didn't live together.

So if I knew I wanted to be with a woman my whole life, I would want to marry her, and it would bother me if she didn't feel that way too, because it implies she doesn't necessary want to spend her whole life with me. That's also the reason I wouldn't want to get into a marriage in which one of us isn't committed to a lasting marriage, because for me that defeats the purpose. I don't want a marriage because of a wedding or because of the social recognition of saying "my wife" or whatever. And the government benefits are nice, but that's not reaaally why I want it either. I want it because of the commitment, and when you have a marriage that results in divorce, then frankly I would rather have not gotten married at all.

All of the above is the reason I tell people I'm probably not going to end up getting married. I am up to this point pretty skeptical that a great many people feel similarly about marriage. And that's okay, it's just how I feel.

What's sad about it is that it is likely to, in the future, prematurely end some very nice relationships, because if I get to the point where I want to marry a person but realize they don't also want that, then that relationship has become unhealthy and should end. And it will be sad that it ends for that reason, but better that than having a relationship with an elephant in the room which equates to a perpetually denied marriage proposal. Lol. Once you add that kind of temporal dimension to a relationship that one party is uncomfortable with, in context it just becomes a relationship waiting to end.

Anyway, enough of that. I'm young yet and don't like to think about marriage, because it depresses me. It'll start to suck more when people I know have happy marriages. Bastards. Lol.

Octavious, you got it right. It depends on your character. I love to surprise people so I risked it, choosing the ring myself and carrying it in my pocket for a week, waiting for the right moment. I could have made a terrible mistake, of course, but it turned out so well that now, years after the fateful day, she will talk about it to anyone who cares to listen.

If the woman doesn't like it, just return it and get a different one. Chances are you need to bring it back to get it resized anyway.

My advice to young chaps would be to wait until you are a bit older before contemplating Marriage.

Give yourself the chance to get a proper education, and get your career started,
travel, & find out who the hell you are, what you want to do / achieve.

Also start stacking away the cash, get some investments going.

As i remark'd earlier, women are damn expensive to care & maintain & it won't just be financial costs, there is a huge emotional investment that you will have to make.

SO, wait, and don't just marry the first woman that gives you a decent headjob etc

Be selective, don't get stuck with a dud one

Honesty, Caring, Thinking, she will need to have these basic qualities

Be ruthless, do not accept second best

I think a good plan is from age 17, work, travel have fun, but don't get tied down
for 20 years.
That gives you plenty of time to get the financial resources well sorted

Then swoop on a fine young filly with the good character, well bred, chaste & pure,
still innocent and train her correctly.

most couples set the "established expected behaviour rules beteween themselves"
very quickly whilst in that first dizzy romantic stage, and a lot of young chaps let the
woman get her way in too much of this stuff.

for example. it's great to be together, but you both also need time apart

so if the bloke wants his life to be one where he can start most days with a dawn assault on Her Indoors, then off to the Golf Club play 18, then spend a lazy afternoon having a punt on the gee gees & a few drinks with mates, returning to hearth & home,
squawking kids and everloving wife at whatever time suits him,
.... without having Her Indoors ringing you up to find out "when are you coming home ?
and get some milk and tampons.."

Then you will need to start training her from the start.

you'll have to knock over all her "complaints"

eg i was worried about you---- well i am an adult & can look after myself
& be prepared to make her cry occasionally

from the start you will need to employ a housecleaner for her,
With kids etc you will need to employ nannies & tutors

you will also have to indulge your woman with expensive trinkets, lingerie, flowers
& a myriad of clothes, cosmetic & "health" products etc etc

she'll require a sports car first then a decent saloon if she's a city type,
or hobby farm with stables and horses and a suitable vehicles if she's a country lass.

It's no surprise the divorce rates are what they are

so don't be one of those saps who rushes into and out of two marriages by 45
and is emasculated, financially crippled and doomed from then on.

That's exactly what a wife should be, a servant. Thanks for that invaluable advice, all this time I've been thinking about together yet somewhat independent so if something goes wrong no-one is left hanging, but your post has shown me the light. I gotta start training myself a wife-servant today.

be prepared to have a go at "punching well above your weight category"

If you are not blessed by nature to be a "Himbo" eg Brad Pitt,

then "think long term", study really hard, get excellent tertiary qualifications
aquire modest wealth and secure it, make yourself interesting by some means, travel,
a talent, eg painting portraits...... sounds really dumb doesn't it....
even if you are a average painter, by "study" & practise you might develop a skill to be good at nudes........semi nudes......
if that strategy suits your talents
save up the cash and spend a 6 month summer holiday in Paris amongst the artists
and sketch, draw as much as you v
can and return home
go out and do street chalk artworks and you'll start pulling unbeleivable women,
you'll have the interesting anecdotes to tell, the sketches to show

Men, there are a few things that you can do to distinguish yourself to women.

first they generally abhor a dirty bathroom
so always have your pad set up correctly when entertaining
spotless bathroom and clean sheets
flowers flowers flowers

yes you can have surfboards in the dining room and a pinball machine in the lounge
all the blokey stuff golf clubs etc dispersed around and about

but the deadly trio
bathroom, bedroom, kitchen
are the 3 hurdles most chaps break legs at.

if you present them with those three in superlative condition
you have just promoted yourself above at least half the male population.

Call me cynical, but you will be wasting your time and mental capacities trying to UNDERSTAND a woman, they are deep, mysterious creatures,

I think you are better off setting yourself up in life,
working out what they want, how to behave, what to say, how to manage the different scenarios of your encounters with them.

PREGNANCY SCARE

DON"T PANIC !!!! or at least do not display any outward sign of your shock
display happiness and delight, start congratulating her for conceiving,
do not mention paternity doubts, start talking about the nature of your relationship with the woman in any way that might be interpreted by her as you starting to find "wiggle room".. start discussing names for your potential offspring... etc

Then, unless it is a much wanted conception, start praying to all the gods that it will turn out to be a false alarm & learn the lesson to always use contraception when having casual sex.
The odds are against successful conception
and ten days later after being at full acting capacity in her presence
it's a fasle alarm, and she will treat you so well because you were always going to be there for her.

if you go the other way, false alarm
but you panicked, she will NEVER FORGET, OR FORGIVE YOU
and use the incident as a weapon whenever it suits her

arrgh another typo
in the preganacy scare advice
...... display Happines and Delight, DO NOT start taliking about your relationship..
is how it should read

... or talking

a typo in a typo correction

Wow.

Marriage?
Just be prepared to give all your worldly goods away forever to someone you now despise and pay her to stay in luxury for the rest of her life.
Then find a cardboard box to sleep in,

I'm doing a good deal on divorcee's cardboard boxes right now.
Get the info on fuckedupmarriagesandhowtosurvivethem.com.

Wow this is so bad... Do you ^really belive that?
Shape mold slave crap...

Some sweet sentement re ring is nice but really.
Find your equal.

Beauty fades love endures and a woman whom you can talk to and with will always be sexy, please and satisfy you.

Look to their mind 1st then the wraping... 17 years now i've been married only just 40.

Respect your self and don't settle for a bimbo

If the engagement is a 'surprise' then chances are the whole partnership is not going to work well. People invest too much in drama and theatre when the issue is about a working relationship.

Putin33 already has enough drama and theater with conspiracy theories. His wife is a docile plump Russian who admires her husband's grim determination to bring the light of communism to the four corners of the world.

She's more red than I am and more determined. Sorry, we don't abide by Slovene stereotypes about gender roles.

Oops did I say communism? I meant stalinism.

Marry for true love. If you can't be happy in seeing yourself grow old and grey with her, then she isn't the one. The rest of your life is a long period time and being married for that long should give you pause before you decide to marry. Celebrating my 22nd year on 4 Aug. 5 children and I still love my wife.

Douchey redbaiting in a harmless marriage thread, can't say I'm surprised.

@ Putin

Surprise engagements only happen in Holywood. An element of surprise can come from the choice of ring, timing and location which if done well will make the event rather fun. You need a bit of drama and theatre in life or we'd all go mad.

People's constant need for entertainment and stimulation drives them mad. We have the attention span of gnats. We can't celebrate and take solace in the ordinary and mundane.

There is little ordinary and mundane about marriage or engagement. An apple can be eaten and enjoyed straight from the tree, but there are some great meals that call for a bit of spice to make the most of their potential.

Spicy meals can give you indigestion.

In other words, Putin33 has no balls.

Everything is about chest thumping machismo to you, isn't it? Obsessed with your genitals, much?

At least I have them.

Congrats, go play with them and leave the conversing to adults.

Putin33, this is the thread you're looking for: threadID=817799