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Those Times When Someone's Opinion Is...Just Wrong...(NFL QBs?)
...as I'm sure mine often is? ;) Well, here's a multi-million dollar example: http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown-corner/joe-flacco-thinks-nfl-best-quarterback-005500221.html Yeah...I like Flacco as a QB, I honestly do...but in a league with Peyton, Brady, Eli, Aaron Rodgers, Drew Brees...for starters...no. NOT the best in the NFL. But...who is--rank the QBs?
After all, while he was a good QB, a HOFer, and probably Top 20...
Who in their right mind, even in Pittsburgh, would equate Terry Bradshaw to Joe Montana--both won 4 SBs, but clearly, there's a difference in quality.
Now, I'm not saying Eli *is* better than Peyton right now...
I'm just saying:
1. It's a discussion that, I think, at least now can be entertained, with Peyton likely nearly done and Eli in the prime of his career and seemingly only getting better
2. The fact that Eli, it seems, plays better on the road and in the clutch/playoffs/SB than his brother...look at all his road wins vs. Peyton's troubles sometimes outside of a domed stadium/his home field in Indy, and then look at the SB performances--Eli's 2-for-2, and in both cases he won the game with some tight passing at just the right moment, and Peyton's 1-for-2, easily besting the Bears, but throwing the losing INT against the Bountygate Saints.
I'd still easily put Peyton in the Top 10, probably Top 5 I'd go Montana/Elway/Favre/Brady/Peyton, off the top of my head...
I'm just saying, where once Eli was clearly good but not the "lesser" of the two great Manning Bros. QBs, now, I think, in the years coming, we might see that be reevaluated as Eli has that extra ring, has better success on the road, and is hitting his prime...Peyton still has the huge stats and years of success and the better record, though, so again, not at all a set argument, Peyton's still the better of the two, right now, just saying, that discussion COULD start to occur.
Ok, that makes sense. The only thing I would add is that you never got the impression, either statistically or using the eyeball test, that Eli could be an all-time great QB, which you got with Peyton almost immediately. Let me put it this way: at the peak of his career, Eli is among the best quarterbacks currently in the NFL; by the peak of Peyton's career, he was considered among the best quarterbacks ever.
Putting Eli in your list and not Big Ben is a tragedy.
Concerning unibrow, though, every NFL QB thinks he's the best. They are competitors out to prove everyone wrong. He's got a chip on his shoulder, and is a decent QB, but Flacco isn't even top 5... MAYBE top 10.
I think at this point Big Ben is past his prime and peaked with his ONE Super Bowl. Eli, with his TWO Super Bowls, is just hitting his prime as a QB. After last season, the two shouldn't even be mentioned in the same sentence. That being said, I agree that Flacco is *maybe* top ten, but consider the other QBs in the league:
Eli, Peyton, Brees, Brady, Stafford, Rivers, Ryan, Schaub, Rodgers, Newton, Vick...even Alex Smith, Kevin Kolb, and Matt Hasselbeck had better passer ratings last season than Flacco. Being on a team with a great defense and great running game will obscure your QB's faults. Case in point: 2000 Ravens with Trent Dilfer as QB.
Last year, Trent Dilfer recommended that Joe Flacco embrace the view that he kind of sucked. Dilfer said that he realizes he's the worst QB to ever win a Super Bowl, and he wears that as a badge of pride. At that point, you've effectively silenced your critics, because what are they going to say? Dilfer says that Flacco has gotten too defensive about being criticized and it's really just making him worse.
Anyway, yeah, I think Matt Stafford deserves to be in the conversation of current QB's too. And Eli won his first ring due to a really crazy catch sticking, Peyton lost a Super Bowl against guys who were deliberately trying to hurt him. In any event, Eli is good, but I think he's too streaky to be truly better than Peyton. Peyton has bad games. Eli has bad stretches.
1. Aaron Rodgers 2. Drew Brees 3. Tom Brady 4. Matt Stafford 5. Eli Manning 6. Matt Schaub 7. Phillip Rivers (had an off year, but that's also partly the team's fault) 8. Mike Vick 9. Jay Cutler (wow, how the Bears bombed without him) 10. Big Ben Roethlisberger
Sacred I like that list, although I disagree with it, but I ask: what's your criteria? Is it quarterbacks you would want for one game or one season? Or is it who you'd like to see your team get this season? The Colts, for example, seem to think that a rookie is better for their situation than Peyton Manning, because of the long-term possibilities (even if he's healthy Peyton most likely only has a couple of seasons left in him) and the cost. I think that's wrong but I understand why they did it.
That's who I think are the current 10 best. Peyton will need to show me he can recover from that injury before he gets back on it. At that point I'd put him at 4 and slide everyone down.
Cutler got hurt making a tackle after an INT, so the O line had little to do with his injury, and Forte was already saying the Bears were more or less running him to death, so his was likely more of a playcalling related injury than anything else.
I have only one thing to add to this discussion, then I'm off to other threads.
This NFL season proved, definitively, that Peyton Manning is MVP of the entire league. When Tom Brady was out for most of a season, the Pats still did respectably well. With Peyton out, the Colts fell apart. The team was, for the last decade, /not/ the Indianapolis Colts; the team was the Indianapolis Peyton Mannings. The man redefined the game. He was and is the best.
Umm, BigBen has been to THREE Superbowls and has TWO rings. While people like to point out his first superbowl he played terribly, check out the game at mile high for the chance to get to the superbowl. He owned Champ Bailey (who was in his prime) the WHOLE GAME.
The second superbowl he pulled off better passes than Eli this last superbowl.
I hate everyone getting on the Eli boat. He's a good QB, no doubt, but he isn't everything everyone is making him out to be. He had a good superbowl with good passes, but he is streaky as shit.
Ben has had two seasons of bad injuries. Let's see how he does this year when his offense isn't bubblescreens and deep passes, shall we?
@SD: Mike Vick isn't anything but a mediocre QB that runs, Jay Cutler hasn't done anything to prove he's in a class of the top 10 except hype, Matt Schaub hasn't won a postseason game with a high octane offense...
I mean, I think we can all agree that the Texans' main deficiency, prior to last year, was having a shit defense, and that was exacerbated with Peyton Manning being in the division. Schaub was hurt before they got to the playoffs in the first year they had a legitimate shot at it, with factors outside of his control hurting their chances the previous years.
But really, I admit my top ten might not be the best, let's see one from someone else.
Peyton was basically couching their entire O-line and was calling most of the plays which is why they fell apart. It's also why I said Peyton > Eli. That takes some massive talent to be able to do that.
message to all special games hosts who contacted me recently
Apologies in advance for being a prima donna and taking forum space for my personal needs here, but I legitimately let a couple of invitations fall off my messages page without replying in time because of being ridiculously busy.
I Personally didnt liked England, older france and New France for leaving the game , Moreover Italy is highly critisized. I think Austria played good and Germany is very good for me or its Non Aggression!
Elites and (Reasonably Highly Rated) Scum Public Press Game
Sarg's thread made me realize that I've never played public press and would rather like to. Anyone in the top 100 GR is welcome to join, though I can increase the limit if we need more, and people in the top 50 should probably join Sarg's first (not trying to poach players here). Details are negotiable.
As the Hobbies thread seems to indicate, we have a few writers among us. Let's compose something together, shall we?
Rules: 1) Limit yourself from 1 to 3 sentences. 2) No double posts. If you make a typo, the next poster just has to roll with it. 3) No digs at other users. If I have to spell this one out explicitly for you, then don't bother posting in my thread. 4) Just have fun with it!
The Other day, King Atom professed the salvation of jesus Christ. Since then, he has talked agout fucking men in the ass. I wonder....how many believe in King Atom's ass-fucking God, Jesus Christ, who apparently is an ass-fucking homosexual??? NOT that there is anthing wrong with that....
I'm sure we all have interests besides Diplomacy. What are they? I've started making lamps out of glass bottles. You can see 2 finished ones here: https://plus.google.com/photos/112097194861235770883/albums/5726520958325469041?authkey=CNCVuouql4XN8gE What about the rest of you?
We tried this on vdip a while ago but It never really worked out, I still think its a cool concept though and was wondering if people here would like to try it. The idea is a classic game where you aren't allowed I lie. That doesn't mean you won't misdirect, or mislead people, but you can't outright lie.