Diplomacy 2.0

Developers and contributors can find a link to our github page and engage in development project planning here.
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A_Tin_Can
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Re: Diplomacy 2.0

#21 Post by A_Tin_Can » Tue Dec 18, 2018 7:54 pm

There’s an issue tracker with an extensive list of issues, on the github. There isn’t a roadmap, because no one is currently focussing development work on webdiplomacy.

There is a changelog for users, you can find it under the help pages.
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Peregrine Falcon
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Re: Diplomacy 2.0

#22 Post by Peregrine Falcon » Tue Dec 18, 2018 10:05 pm

A_Tin_Can wrote:
Tue Dec 18, 2018 7:54 pm
There’s an issue tracker with an extensive list of issues, on the github. There isn’t a roadmap, because no one is currently focussing development work on webdiplomacy.
That may be true, but there are broad scale changes currently being made to the site, which lay-developers are not privy to. Some better system of intra-developer communication would be useful. The dev forum once served that purpose. Perhaps the github wiki (which for some reason is turned on) could serve that well now?
A_Tin_Can wrote:
Tue Dec 18, 2018 7:54 pm
There is a changelog for users, you can find it under the help pages.
Yes... because we definitely keep that up to date...

jmo1121109
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Re: Diplomacy 2.0

#23 Post by jmo1121109 » Tue Dec 18, 2018 11:03 pm

I have asked Kestas to look into this thread. He will hopefully get the time to do so over the holidays.

wulfheart
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Re: Diplomacy 2.0

#24 Post by wulfheart » Thu Dec 20, 2018 9:05 pm

orathaic wrote:
Sun Dec 16, 2018 10:43 am
This sounds awesome, can I ask about live game support, so like sockets/push notifications, maybe even client to client communication (which I assume the technology for has come a long way... As has support for sockets).

Cause road map and features weren't listed...
We already have it on our roadmap (which unfortunately is in German).

NotInTheFace
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Re: Diplomacy 2.0

#25 Post by NotInTheFace » Thu Dec 20, 2018 9:48 pm

flash2015 wrote:
Sun Sep 02, 2018 8:21 pm
Please not PHP and dear $DIETY not node.js.
Why not node.js?

NotInTheFace
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Re: Diplomacy 2.0

#26 Post by NotInTheFace » Thu Dec 20, 2018 9:51 pm

I would like to offer my hand as a developer / contributer. Is there a central location I can use to contact others working on the project.
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Claesar
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Re: Diplomacy 2.0

#27 Post by Claesar » Thu Dec 20, 2018 9:54 pm

NotInTheFace wrote:
Thu Dec 20, 2018 9:51 pm
I would like to offer my hand as a developer / contributer. Is there a central location I can use to contact others working on the project.
We'd love to welcome you to the team! I'll send you a PM.

flash2015
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Re: Diplomacy 2.0

#28 Post by flash2015 » Fri Dec 21, 2018 6:01 pm

NotInTheFace wrote:
Thu Dec 20, 2018 9:48 pm
flash2015 wrote:
Sun Sep 02, 2018 8:21 pm
Please not PHP and dear $DIETY not node.js.
Why not node.js?
Because javascript projects of any significant size and complexity are almost impossible to maintain. There are some people that can do very well with javascript's limitations and love using it for everything, but that is only a small minority of developers.

flash2015
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Re: Diplomacy 2.0

#29 Post by flash2015 » Fri Dec 21, 2018 6:02 pm

<double post>

orathaic
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Re: Diplomacy 2.0

#30 Post by orathaic » Sat Dec 22, 2018 2:42 am

Flash, maybe that was the case before the latest version of js... At least I think it has gotten better, with actual classes, and I portable modules.
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jmo1121109
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Re: Diplomacy 2.0

#31 Post by jmo1121109 » Sat Dec 22, 2018 5:34 am

flash2015 wrote:
Fri Dec 21, 2018 6:01 pm
NotInTheFace wrote:
Thu Dec 20, 2018 9:48 pm
flash2015 wrote:
Sun Sep 02, 2018 8:21 pm
Please not PHP and dear $DIETY not node.js.
Why not node.js?
Because javascript projects of any significant size and complexity are almost impossible to maintain. There are some people that can do very well with javascript's limitations and love using it for everything, but that is only a small minority of developers.
Naw, that's not true anymore. Large companies are using react, angular, nodejs, etc. They are all pretty usable these days.

VillageIdiot
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Re: Diplomacy 2.0

#32 Post by VillageIdiot » Sat Dec 22, 2018 6:05 am

There’s nothing wrong with node or JavaScript via modern frameworks. 88% of all websites use JavaScript and many of the top ones utilize Node.js (NetFlix, Uber, eBay). Not sure why anybody would turn their nose up at these options aside from lack of proficient resources.

flash2015
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Re: Diplomacy 2.0

#33 Post by flash2015 » Sat Dec 22, 2018 4:45 pm

VillageIdiot wrote:
Sat Dec 22, 2018 6:05 am
There’s nothing wrong with node or JavaScript via modern frameworks. 88% of all websites use JavaScript and many of the top ones utilize Node.js (NetFlix, Uber, eBay). Not sure why anybody would turn their nose up at these options aside from lack of proficient resources.
I have a strong preference for strongly typed languages vs. interpreted languages like javascript...and I have seen enough poorly written javascript code in my time (javascript gives you more than enough rope to hang yourself with) or incompatible code written by multiple teams/companies (I have gone through many mergers) that I don't like to deal with it. And then you have the flavour of the month frameworks (perhaps we are finally getting to stability?). Again there are some great developers out there that do wonders with it, but you want something that is easy to maintain by your bog standard average developer over the longer term.

Javascript also has a lot of limitations to work with a browser (e.g. everything is async, thread limitations). Why in $DIETY name bring over all these limitations to the server when it doesn't add anything other than making simple things harder and more error prone?

Perhaps things like TypeScript make things better and easier to maintain...or using a different compile from language (Dart, closure, GWT etc.).

But this is just my opinion. I am sure you disagree.

wulfheart
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Re: Diplomacy 2.0

#34 Post by wulfheart » Sat Dec 22, 2018 8:12 pm

I understand your point. Especially the async/await is really painful BUT I think we have to differentiate between server- and clientside js.

orathaic
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Re: Diplomacy 2.0

#35 Post by orathaic » Sat Dec 29, 2018 9:47 am

Just because I was reminded elsewhere.

Is it possible to alter the variant system so every map variant has some press options.

So ancient med with full press/public press/gunboat would be one variant, but with three options.

With a future possibility of adding new press options (like grey and black press, and touch diplomacy), and ultimately also a fog of war option (which is not technically a press option, but map information limitations are like press limitations, in that they don't change the underlying map/movement options, it only limits information which the players have to make decisions about what moves to make...)

Is there a system to separate out these options so they would be available for every map variant?

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Re: Diplomacy 2.0

#36 Post by Peregrine Falcon » Sat Dec 29, 2018 3:45 pm

orathaic wrote:
Sat Dec 29, 2018 9:47 am
Is it possible to alter the variant system so every map variant has some press options.
Perhaps I misunderstand you, but it is currently possible to change press options for variant games. You can already play Ancient Med gunboats, for example.

As for adding new press variants, I'd say that most of what you listed are pretty niche, compared to what we have. For that reason, I don't see a need to host them here while vDip has them. Fog of War would be super cool to add, but from what I understand, would need to be almost coded from scratch in order to fit.

A_Tin_Can
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Re: Diplomacy 2.0

#37 Post by A_Tin_Can » Sat Dec 29, 2018 3:57 pm

Pretty sure they're already separate, Orathaic?

orathaic
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Re: Diplomacy 2.0

#38 Post by orathaic » Sat Dec 29, 2018 9:51 pm

Cool ATC, it has been a while.

Fog of war and touch would be great additions, IMHO.

A_Tin_Can
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Re: Diplomacy 2.0

#39 Post by A_Tin_Can » Sun Dec 30, 2018 12:48 am

Claesar wrote:
Thu Dec 20, 2018 9:54 pm
NotInTheFace wrote:
Thu Dec 20, 2018 9:51 pm
I would like to offer my hand as a developer / contributer. Is there a central location I can use to contact others working on the project.
We'd love to welcome you to the team! I'll send you a PM.
Is there some sort of development team that I'm not aware of?

A_Tin_Can
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Re: Diplomacy 2.0

#40 Post by A_Tin_Can » Sun Dec 30, 2018 1:13 am

So, I've been "looking after" the source for webdiplomacy for a few years now - largely what that means is writing emails to people saying "yeah go ahead, I'd love to have you work on X", and then never hearing from them again.

I think it's really important that people are empowered to be able to work on webdip if they want. And a good way to empower people is to have people collaborating (or at least running a change past others). This is why we have a section of the forum (right here). I think saying "yeah, we have a team, let me PM you" undermines the value of this section of the forum.

Another advantage to open discussion is that we don't end up developing features that the site wouldn't accept (I've been against adding features just because we can - people who have been around for a while may remember some analysis I did a while back that suggested that the more options we had for games, the fewer games actually got played).

This is the reason that we maintain the issue tracker in github - anything sitting open in there is something that we'd definitely like to add at some point.

If you want to add a feature that isn't in the issue tracker, a good place to start is either to open an issue or to discuss it here.
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