Mafia 57 Matrix

[BunnyGo]

I basically said the same thing three times tbh

Cool. Can you start off my survey? Top 4 scum reads in any order, no explanation necessary. Go:

You’re gonna be sorely disappointed, read what I wrote right above this message in response to bo re: my reads this game

I see why bozo does this now.

[BunnyGo]

So ghug, why is asking for townreads better in your opinion? I've never done these surveys before, usually bozo does them. I usually mock them. But the level of engagement this game is disappointing.

[BunnyGo]

Who pounced on damo for his non-VT slip?

Demon, rdr, Bismarck, someone else?

Hmm...actually, here's a question for you ghug (and for me). If scum did pick up on that. Why not NK him instead of bozo? Did bozo reveal himself with that non-VT issue also?

[BunnyGo]

@Jamie sorry I got it wrong. Having reread you were clearly warning people not to claim VT.

My mistake (which is NAI in mpov but individuals can think what they like).

Having reread I now am wondering about rdr whose post I shouldn't have commented on so readily.

##vote rdr

Care to explain why?

Your reference to the Chosen has nothing to do with Jamiet and you are blatantly lying.

##vote Damo

I am not sure I buy damo's explanation either.

##VOTE damo

NO! Bozo seemed all over it.

So...if Scum understood what was going on, why did they not NK damo?

[Nanook]

That's a dramatic departure from the narcissist and egomaniac I had you pegged for on D1.

Given that your "usual approach" is not going to be as effective since you don't know any of us, what have you done to adapt your approach?

He's like you-quality at diplomacy, FWIW. More mouth than anything else.

I'd second that question though, Nanook. You say you've played on a bunch of different sites. Have you managed to learn a way to be useful in your first games in other places? Wanna link one in case a tryhard (not me) cares to go read?

I mean I’m mostly not that useful tbh, especially early. There’s also that usually when I play somewhere for the first time there’s at least one person I’m familiar with, and I can kinda latch onto that and build outward. But yeah, 95% of my reads rely on knowing at least some amount of meta, so...this is basically the worst situation for me to be as town lol. Here’s a couple links to games I’m useful in:

http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 106&t=1904

https://forum.mafia451.com/t/dbz-mafia- ... 9?u=nanook

https://www.playdiplomacy.com/forum/vie ... 14&t=60569


And here’s a game I played with complete strangers where I was scum in, for contrast/to prove I know how to fake it with strangers:

https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/th ... ampionship

[Nanook]

I wouldn't say Nanook is putting no effort in. There's effort there. Just most of the posts are... inconsequential and don't serve to drive conversation. To me, that's a bigger problem than not posting his reads at night.

Bunny, I'll humor you.

Scum reads in order
emc
Bunny (only in 2nd because an emc flip provides more information in case I'm wrong)
.
.
.
Nanook
Theflyingboat (hard lurker who has contributed nothing so far, and has largely escaped scrutiny while others were called out. Only made a meaningful post last night when I called them out specifically. I'll give Temasek a little more time given they're a sub before I start viewing them similarly)

If you’re waiting for me to drive conversation you’re gonna be waiting a long time, that’s not really what I do

[Nanook]

Asking for townreads is usually better if you’re gonna do surveys tbh, a lot of scum hesitate to hard TR partners and it can show up a bit more easily than if you’re asking for scumreads

[BunnyGo]

Asking for townreads is usually better if you’re gonna do surveys tbh, a lot of scum hesitate to hard TR partners and it can show up a bit more easily than if you’re asking for scumreads

huh...go figure.

[goldfinger0303]

So...if Scum understood what was going on, why did they not NK damo?

Bunny, it's so very hard to follow your train of thought sometimes. Especially since it can be very bunny-like and go in circles.

Because to me, you're asking a question to the void that you've already answered. Unless I misread your hypothesis on why worcej was killed earlier; which to me seemed pretty logical.

Get some rest bunny. Asking the same question twice in different ways isn't productive. And when you wake up tomorrow, let me know what it is Jamiet said between Friday night and Saturday that caused you to go from town to scum on him.

[BunnyGo]

So...if Scum understood what was going on, why did they not NK damo?

Bunny, it's so very hard to follow your train of thought sometimes. Especially since it can be very bunny-like and go in circles.

Because to me, you're asking a question to the void that you've already answered. Unless I misread your hypothesis on why worcej was killed earlier; which to me seemed pretty logical.

Get some rest bunny. Asking the same question twice in different ways isn't productive. And when you wake up tomorrow, let me know what it is Jamiet said between Friday night and Saturday that caused you to go from town to scum on him.

Here's the question:

Damo was called out hard on D1 for not being VT. It's why he was almost the Daykill.

If scum understood what was going on, they had a sure-fire shot at him that night. Why not take it? Why gamble on bozo?

[BunnyGo]

So...if Scum understood what was going on, why did they not NK damo?

Bunny, it's so very hard to follow your train of thought sometimes. Especially since it can be very bunny-like and go in circles.

Because to me, you're asking a question to the void that you've already answered. Unless I misread your hypothesis on why worcej was killed earlier; which to me seemed pretty logical.

Get some rest bunny. Asking the same question twice in different ways isn't productive. And when you wake up tomorrow, let me know what it is Jamiet said between Friday night and Saturday that caused you to go from town to scum on him.

Cool, I'll get back to you in more detail about Jamie after I sleep a bit.

[Nanook]

Unless all six scum did not read the setup I don’t think it’s particularly meaningful that damo didn’t die last night tbh

[BunnyGo]

So...if Scum understood what was going on, why did they not NK damo?

Bunny, it's so very hard to follow your train of thought sometimes. Especially since it can be very bunny-like and go in circles.

Because to me, you're asking a question to the void that you've already answered. Unless I misread your hypothesis on why worcej was killed earlier; which to me seemed pretty logical.

Get some rest bunny. Asking the same question twice in different ways isn't productive. And when you wake up tomorrow, let me know what it is Jamiet said between Friday night and Saturday that caused you to go from town to scum on him.

Here's the question:

Damo was called out hard on D1 for not being VT. It's why he was almost the Daykill.

If scum understood what was going on, they had a sure-fire shot at him that night. Why not take it? Why gamble on bozo?

The difference is on N1, there's NO RISK to the scum team hitting the virus (not that I think they should care, but that's another story).

On N2, that's why they could hit worcej, they were sure he wasn't a recruited virus.

But N1, they should have known that Damo was a non-VT and had no protection.

So what happened?

[BunnyGo]

Unless all six scum did not read the setup I don’t think it’s particularly meaningful that damo didn’t die last night tbh

Six? Stop f***ing with me.

Last night, I agree.

But N1!!! That's interesting!

[ghug]

So ghug, why is asking for townreads better in your opinion? I've never done these surveys before, usually bozo does them. I usually mock them. But the level of engagement this game is disappointing.

I caught bo once because his team all put each other at the bottom of their list of townreads.

Mocking is still better, but scum have usually put more thought into their scumreads than their townreads because they have to push lynches, so it's easier to count them or.

[goldfinger0303]

Here's the question:

Damo was called out hard on D1 for not being VT. It's why he was almost the Daykill.

If scum understood what was going on, they had a sure-fire shot at him that night. Why not take it? Why gamble on bozo?

I don't know Bunny. Maybe because he was almost a daykill? Maybe because they thought only the virus would out themselves so readily? Or they had a better inclination on bozo.

More importantly - what do we gain from knowing this, as town? What purpose does this conversation hold?

[BunnyGo]

So ghug, why is asking for townreads better in your opinion? I've never done these surveys before, usually bozo does them. I usually mock them. But the level of engagement this game is disappointing.

I caught bo once because his team all put each other at the bottom of their list of townreads.

Mocking is still better, but scum have usually put more thought into their scumreads than their townreads because they have to push lynches, so it's easier to count them or.

Interesting.

Ok, so why do you think Damo survived night 1?

[ghug]

Who pounced on damo for his non-VT slip?

Demon, rdr, Bismarck, someone else?

Hmm...actually, here's a question for you ghug (and for me). If scum did pick up on that. Why not NK him instead of bozo? Did bozo reveal himself with that non-VT issue also?

This was actually not what I was getting at at all, but it's also a decent line of thought. Maybe they didn't buy it? It was pretty obvious, so I don't know why they wouldn't.

(Side note, Jamie, this was all your fault)

[ghug]

Unless all six scum did not read the setup I don’t think it’s particularly meaningful that damo didn’t die last night tbh

Lol 6

I think not killing damo was clearly suboptimal. Understanding the setup is easier than determining the smartest plays.

[BunnyGo]

Here's the question:

Damo was called out hard on D1 for not being VT. It's why he was almost the Daykill.

If scum understood what was going on, they had a sure-fire shot at him that night. Why not take it? Why gamble on bozo?

I don't know Bunny. Maybe because he was almost a daykill? Maybe because they thought only the virus would out themselves so readily? Or they had a better inclination on bozo.

More importantly - what do we gain from knowing this, as town? What purpose does this conversation hold?

Well...look at the players who called damo out hard. If I were just thinking about the push to kill him on D1, I'd say "oh look...there's some scum who realize what's up and are cynically using it to get a miskill on a PR on D1"

And if I stopped there. That's not bad. But as I said to Hamilton, only partial credit.

Because any of those scum noticing it should TAKE THE SURE SHOT.

So the fact they went after bozo tells us something of:

1) none of damo's hard pushers were scum and somehow the whole scum team missed the point?

or

2) somehow bozo tripped up even harder, despite being one of the people who pushed damo and ALL of us missed it except the scum (even on reread)

or

3) scum knew Damo wasn't VT, weren't sure *what* bozo was. But decided to remove a "dangerous" player.

Personally, I find all three cases hard to believe (is there a 4th?). In case 1, we get some "townleans" of rdr, and Bismarck. In case 2 and 3, then rdr and Bismarck are stronger scum leans.

Case 1 also pushes many who didn't focus on Damo's unintentional reveal as being scummy.