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Why did God create Covid-19?
Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 9:21 am
by Jamiet99uk
Genuine question for anyone who believes in "God".
Why would he/she/it create the Covid-19 virus?
Why did the Pope and a gathering of top religious leaders just hold a public event where they prayed for God to help our scientists find a cure / vaccine more quickly? Surely if God is real, he could just cause Covid-19 to stop, now, this second. So why don't they pray for him to do that? Is it because he doesn't really exist?
Re: Why did God create Covid-19?
Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 9:51 am
by Octavious
Really, this is theology 101 stuff. It has been answered millions of times by millions of people. You're genuinely claiming to have never had the "why is there suffering when there's a loving God?" discussion before?
Re: Why did God create Covid-19?
Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 11:43 am
by Jamiet99uk
Octavious wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2020 9:51 am
Really, this is theology 101 stuff. It has been answered millions of times by millions of people. You're genuinely claiming to have never had the "why is there suffering when there's a loving God?" discussion before?
You explain it to me.
Why did God invent Covid-19?
Re: Why did God create Covid-19?
Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 12:25 pm
by Octavious
I can only explain from my own perspective, which I dare say is not particularly representative.
Still, the short answer is He didn't. He created the universe in which things like Covid-19 can happen, but He didn't specifically create it and fire it at humanity like some sort of story book marvel comic deity smiting the unworthy.
Re: Why did God create Covid-19?
Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 12:34 pm
by Octavious
In terms of the broader Christian perspective, that would be an ecumenical matter
Re: Why did God create Covid-19?
Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 1:30 pm
by orathaic
The problem of evil. You can say it has been answered many times. But to claim that any of those answers are satisfactory is entirely an other matter.
Re: Why did God create Covid-19?
Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 1:56 pm
by RoganJosh
I'm not sure that death is necessarily evil, from a christian perspective.
Re: Why did God create Covid-19?
Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 3:25 pm
by Octavious
.
Re: Why did God create Covid-19?
Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 3:26 pm
by Octavious
orathaic wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2020 1:30 pm
The problem of evil. You can say it has been answered many times. But to claim that any of those answers are satisfactory is entirely an other matter.
That’s very much down to the individual I guess. I find myself satisfied, so to not claim any of the answers to be satisfactory would be impossible.
Re: Why did God create Covid-19?
Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 4:35 pm
by Jamiet99uk
Octavious wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2020 12:25 pm
I can only explain from my own perspective, which I dare say is not particularly representative.
Still, the short answer is He didn't. He created the universe in which things like Covid-19 can happen, but He didn't specifically create it and fire it at humanity like some sort of story book marvel comic deity smiting the unworthy.
Why did he decide to create a universe in which viruses and diseases would cause mass suffering and death, rather than deciding not to invent such horrors?
Why would that be a good, loving thing to do?
Watching a child die of a disease you created, which they have contracted through no fault or malice of their own, and when you have the power to end their suffering at any moment, but choose not to, while saying "I love you", is not the act of a benevolent, loving mind. It is the act of sadistic, twisted, horrible, evil mind.
I truly hope that God does not exist because the thought of such an evil entity existing is truly the stuff of nightmares.
Re: Why did God create Covid-19?
Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 5:44 pm
by Octavious
It sounds like your thought process never went beyond the superficial.
Consider the alternative. A universe in which nothing bad would happen as God would interfere and prevent it. Your entire existence would never develop further than your average infant. Everything is safe, none of your decisions have any consequence, you never experience more than a handful of human emotions. You are not even permitted to make mistakes as God will not allow you to cause harm to others. Could you imagine such a hell? Could you contemplate such a horrid existence, such a feeble excuse for a life? Our imperfect world with its injustice and its suffering is a paradise compared to the alternative you are contemplating.
Besides which, we do not have anything like as comprehensive an understanding of the universe necessary to be critical of any consciousness that may or may not be behind it. Science has yet to reach the required level.
Re: Why did God create Covid-19?
Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 5:59 pm
by Jamiet99uk
Octavious wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2020 5:44 pm
It sounds like your thought process never went beyond the superficial.
Consider the alternative. A universe in which nothing bad would happen as God would interfere and prevent it. Your entire existence would never develop further than your average infant. Everything is safe, none of your decisions have any consequence, you never experience more than a handful of human emotions. You are not even permitted to make mistakes as God will not allow you to cause harm to others. Could you imagine such a hell? Could you contemplate such a horrid existence, such a feeble excuse for a life? Our imperfect world with its injustice and its suffering is a paradise compared to the alternative you are contemplating.
Besides which, we do not have anything like as comprehensive an understanding of the universe necessary to be critical of any consciousness that may or may not be behind it. Science has yet to reach the required level.
I am not talking about conscious decisions which have negative effects. You are deflecting from my central question.
Your best attempt at an answer sounds like "God created diseases so we would be grateful when we did not get sick and die", is that about it?
Re: Why did God create Covid-19?
Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 6:02 pm
by Jamiet99uk
Sounds like an abusive husband saying his wife should be grateful for the days he doesn't beat her.
Sick.
Re: Why did God create Covid-19?
Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 6:09 pm
by Octavious
No, but as you clearly have no interest in any meaningful discussion it seems pointless carrying on.
No doubt your belief that it is the cool mindlessness of a random uncaring universe that leads to children dying of disease brings you great comfort
Re: Why did God create Covid-19?
Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 6:19 pm
by Jamiet99uk
Octavious wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2020 6:09 pm
No, but as you clearly have no interest in any meaningful discussion it seems pointless carrying on.
No doubt your belief that it is the cool mindlessness of a random uncaring universe that leads to children dying of disease brings you great comfort
That's much less horrifying than believing they suffer and die because their "loving" creator wishes it. At least my way, it's just chance and bad luck. Your way, God is harming and killing on purpose. That's horrible. You're fucked up.
Re: Why did God create Covid-19?
Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 6:20 pm
by Jamiet99uk
I'm happy to discuss the OP with anyone who isn't just here to troll me.
Re: Why did God create Covid-19?
Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 7:00 pm
by Octavious
Jamiet99uk wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2020 6:20 pm
I'm happy to discuss the OP with anyone who isn't just here to troll me.
Your hypocrisy has reached new heights. My sincere congratulations, I never suspected it was possible!
You started this thread with the sole purpose of giving an airing to your frequent hobby of Christian bashing, but have nothing to offer but juvenile arguments that carry the same intellectual weight as observations that dog is god spelt backwards, therefore life's a bitch
.
Maybe someone will be kind and continue to humour you in your high school debating society atheist crusade. Have fun
Re: Why did God create Covid-19?
Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 7:18 pm
by Macchiavelli
I think that by 2020 we all know there are no Gods of any kind.
We're not cave-dwellers trying to figure out where the sun goes at night, we're not politicians in medieval Europe trying to win popular opinion by inventing Zeus or Superman or God or Aphrodite; we've been to the heavens and there is no God there, just us. Science is real, magic is fake.
This is old news.
Zeus did not hit us with Coronavirus, nor did jesus or Allah or Iron Man.
This is science, like the plague, like everything else we've ever encountered.
Science is real, religion is a lie, we have proven this time and time again.
Science is believing because the facts prove you are right, religion is believing because the facts prove you wrong.
Re: Why did God create Covid-19?
Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 7:33 pm
by Octavious
On the contrary, the population of humans who have a belief in God in 2020 is at an all time high. To delude yourself into thinking otherwise is a remarkable triumph of your faith over fact.
And, as any student of history or indeed any scientist can tell you, science and religion are not divorced from each other. A huge number of today's scientists hold religious beliefs, as did the likes of Newton, Darwin, and Einstein before them. One can not study astrophysics or cosmology without an appreciation of the work in these topics carried out by the Vatican Observatory. The entire concept of a struggle between religion and science is a nonsense.
Re: Why did God create Covid-19?
Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 8:32 pm
by Matticus13
Macchiavelli wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2020 7:18 pm
I think that by 2020 we all know there are no Gods of any kind.
We're not cave-dwellers trying to figure out where the sun goes at night, we're not politicians in medieval Europe trying to win popular opinion by inventing Zeus or Superman or God or Aphrodite; we've been to the heavens and there is no God there, just us. Science is real, magic is fake.
This is old news.
Zeus did not hit us with Coronavirus, nor did jesus or Allah or Iron Man.
This is science, like the plague, like everything else we've ever encountered.
Science is real, religion is a lie, we have proven this time and time again.
Science is believing because the facts prove you are right, religion is believing because the facts prove you wrong.
Wut? I don't think it's quite that simple. There are many truths in various religions; many theories and scientific *facts* will be thrown aside when new evidence/observations are made.