MAFIA XXXVII: THE WHEEL OF WEB-TIME

[DoubtingThomas]

Fox, I've always put you at pretty town lean for always having a neutral opinion of me despite Jamie's hard pushes here and there like on here:

I think Doubting Thomas is probably town. He's having a bit of rage with Jamie, but I don't think that scum, even new scum, would let themselves get this wound up. His comment assuming that the scumteam holstered their kill (which I think is unlikely) is odd, yes. But he and Jamiet sniping at each other seems like town-v-town.

I agree with Vecna that mafia is probably holstering their RB rather than risking both of them getting caught. That puts some suspicion on BB for his claims about being roleblocked, and I'm generally skeptical about any PR claims he makes until his death announcement confirms them.

I'm still rereading Teacher, BB, and Worcej, but am willing to ##vote brainbomb for now. Worcej is also an option—am I missing the reason to care about him fake crumbing and "hard claiming" VT? I'm not sure what to make of that scheme, but it doesn't make me think "wow, there's a vanilla townie at work!"

or here

I'm not voting for you, Jamiet, so I didn't think my answer was being solicited. But if you flip town, I think the case against Brainbomb is even stronger for all he's tried to get you lynched.

But I agree that it would be interesting to see some brief speculation from those voting for you what your town flip would mean...

I have explained it in three semi-long posts in the last page.

Can you go read that? And I want your opinion on it, actually.

I think you're tunneling Jamiet is my opinion. And I think you put a lot of work into building that case, and maybe you're right, even. But your casual reaction that you'll just vote Brainbomb if Jamiet is town kinda speaks to how deep in that tunnel you are.

xD haha so thank you for that. However, your D2 made you look more like a scum.

See, now I am starting to be convinced a little bit that he might be a town

but he's not trying at all

Is this scum backing off what he knows is a town lynch?

uhhh... what?

really? You've been town leaning me all game and then when I'm the only one--
no one else-- questions Jamie's strangely limp dick response..and you attk me?
On what world would a scum who has successfully pushed a town lynch go out
their way to go back on their own claims to re-think the situation? I am just
so mad that Jamie played like that, not giving a fuck. It's a shame to have
children like Jamie destroy town side like this and make the game harder for
us townies... I am pretty sure he was playing "meta" like flash suggested lol..

My suspicion is that, even though almost everyone else (besides, maybe Bismarck) thought Jamie was extremely weird (as you can tell from people's reactions to his flip), you are the only one who was cynical enough to keep him at town (for idk what reason, I asked you why I think but no real answer was given). How did you know he was a given town?

[brainbomb]

##End

[Vecna]

Oh for some reason I thought the day would end tonight. Huh

How I wish I was the Joat here

[damo666]

Bismarck I have no goose. I think you are trying to get me Nkd either because you are Brain's scum partner or SK yourself. Otherwise you are just reading me wrong. If I am not here tomorrow my recommended lynch order is Brain Wocej Bismarck Vecna but I'm hoping (at least) one of these goes tonight.

[BismarckAlive]

Damo,

We will see who dies, and I bet it has something to do with my theory.
You have flown under the radar so far, offering nothing but 2 line posts, repartee with people etc. Typical play (or the ideal, really) for SK or Mafia.

Hopefully if I die, my theory is PROVED, and the lynching order will be:

(1) Damo - he is the SK and can ONLY BE KILLED BY LYNCHING DURING THE DAY
(2) Vecna - he is the Janitor/NK executor
(3) Worcej - He is Roleblocker / NK executor when Vecna dies
(4) Brainbomb - popular choice for (1), but Damo is the priority if I die

Also, everybody can be tracked now, so my suggestions to the Town PR:

TRACKER - Track Damo to my house tonight;
JOAT - Use your Tracker chance to track Vecna (likely to my house) tonight, or use your dagger tonight to kill Vecna (will happen at same time as he is killing me)

I am right, and my death will be irrefutable proof.

[DoubtingThomas]

I think I am the most townie person here

so I am probably gonna get killed

[Vecna]

No.....no you wont

[Vecna]

I think Bismarck is doing a gambit, get ready for some fireworks

[DoubtingThomas]

No.....no you wont

how would you know?

cuz u r the scum trying to frame me tomorrow, huh?

[Vecna]

Stop tryharding so much

[Vecna]

Hi bozo

[damo666]

I welcome being tracked as I am not SK (or any PR for that matter) but that being the case it would be a bit of a waste. I have crudely coded my role in 2 separate posts.

I think why Bismarck has gone off on one against me is my call of him and Brain as scum pair is spot on. Haven't a clue who SK is though.

Vecna what precisely do you think will happen? [Fireworks]

[damo666]

Yeah, hi Bozo. What do you think?

[Foxcastle]

Fox, I've always put you at pretty town lean for always having a neutral opinion of me despite Jamie's hard pushes here and there like on here:

LOLOL, see, that looks scummy! Except that it's too scummy to actually be scum, as I don't think scum would make that statement, especially not after having access to some coaching in the mafia QT. Whether or not you scumread me should be based on what I've said and done, not OMGUS. There are plenty of people who scumread me that I still think are town. If you think someone's scum, go build a case.

xD haha so thank you for that. However, your D2 made you look more like a scum.

See, now I am starting to be convinced a little bit that he might be a town

but he's not trying at all

Is this scum backing off what he knows is a town lynch?

uhhh... what?

really? You've been town leaning me all game and then when I'm the only one--
no one else-- questions Jamie's strangely limp dick response..and you attk me?
On what world would a scum who has successfully pushed a town lynch go out
their way to go back on their own claims to re-think the situation? I am just
so mad that Jamie played like that, not giving a fuck. It's a shame to have
children like Jamie destroy town side like this and make the game harder for
us townies... I am pretty sure he was playing "meta" like flash suggested lol..

My suspicion is that, even though almost everyone else (besides, maybe Bismarck) thought Jamie was extremely weird (as you can tell from people's reactions to his flip), you are the only one who was cynical enough to keep him at town (for idk what reason, I asked you why I think but no real answer was given). How did you know he was a given town?

Firstly, you could stand to be more polite. It's just a game and I'm sure you can criticize Jamiet's game play without being an asshole.

Secondly, it takes a lot of effort to push a mislynch through (though you did have some help from Jamiet here), and when scum know it's going to be a mislynch, they sometimes express doubt to make themselves look more townie, because townies don't actually know what's going to happen. So yes, it's certainly possible for a scum who successfully pushed a town lynch to do what you did.

Thirdly, I've previously explained why I didn't find some of the things Jamiet did scummy. Claiming a non-existent role to avoid being lynched without potentially outing a real PR is pretty townie, and Jamiet is such a stickler for the rules and setup that there's no way he thought there was a cop in game. (The thing that did bother me about that is his explanation after that he supposedly knew it was after the deadline and he was joke claiming.) Unvoting to tie it with more than 20 minutes to go in EOD2 is iffy, but it seemed like something Jamiet would do for the reason he said, and 20 minutes isn't nearly close enough for lunch for that to be a truly bad idea. But mostly, I've played a few games with Jamiet, when he has been both town and scum, and mostly I thought his reactions to the catfighting with you Brainbomb was his town reaction. Jamiet is more careful as scum, and while I'm not sure he and Brainbomb can help themselves, and while I'm not saying his scumplay is so great that he couldn't be bogged down in a fight with you, I thought it was more likely that was his town reaction. And as his wagon got closer to going through, his reactions looked townie to me; just like they apparently looked townie enough to you that you expressed doubt about his flip. I would have lynched Worcej and Brainbomb first, so I went with the preferable wagon that was available to me.

Fourthly, I may have been wrong about you tunneling Jamiet. I think you might be tunneling yourself, and it's simply the case that anyone who dares peek in your tunnel gets hit with the vanity train you're driving down the tracks. You are not the only person who lynched Jamiet, I am not the only person who didn't, there are still two scum and a Serial Killer, so try to step back and take a little bit wider view...

[Vecna]

I welcome being tracked as I am not SK (or any PR for that matter) but that being the case it would be a bit of a waste. I have crudely coded my role in 2 separate posts.

I think why Bismarck has gone off on one against me is my call of him and Brain as scum pair is spot on. Haven't a clue who SK is though.

Vecna what precisely do you think will happen? [Fireworks]

Thats the beauty of fireworks isnt it? You just stand and look at it. You dont question fireworks, its just there.

[damo666]

Night time pyrotechnics. Can't wait. Who will get a rocket?

[damo666]

I'm hoping Bismarck gets sunk

[bozotheclown]

Yeah, hi Bozo. What do you think?

Are you asking me what I think about your scum reads? Bismarck and brainbomb are both on my short list of scum suspects, but Bismarck is not in my top three suspects.

[damo666]

Bozo, you have Worcej above Bismarck? What about Vecna? Surely no-one else.

[DoubtingThomas]

LOLOL, see, that looks scummy! Except that it's too scummy to actually be scum, as I don't think scum would make that statement, especially not after having access to some coaching in the mafia QT. Whether or not you scumread me should be based on what I've said and done, not OMGUS. There are plenty of people who scumread me that I still think are town. If you think someone's scum, go build a case.

So like.. I am building a case there. I am saying that it looks like you are working with Jamie

Firstly, you could stand to be more polite. It's just a game and I'm sure you can criticize Jamiet's game play without being an asshole.

Eh... my aggressive attitude is part of the game, so I can try, yes, but I don't think I am obliged to, especially after Jamie's great contribution to creating a ruckus and confusing everyone from the start.

Secondly, it takes a lot of effort to push a mislynch through (though you did have some help from Jamiet here), and when scum know it's going to be a mislynch, they sometimes express doubt to make themselves look more townie, because townies don't actually know what's going to happen. So yes, it's certainly possible for a scum who successfully pushed a town lynch to do what you did.

Except you put me at a pretty strong town before because you didn't think a scum, especially a newb scum, to be so aggressively bussing. So do you really think a newb scum would be the only person that casted a doubt on Jamie's 8 vote wagon? But that is a fair point you are making.

Thirdly, I've previously explained why I didn't find some of the things Jamiet did scummy. Claiming a non-existent role to avoid being lynched without potentially outing a real PR is pretty townie, and Jamiet is such a stickler for the rules and setup that there's no way he thought there was a cop in game.

Unfortunately, I guess you are correct here that Jamie flipped town. But I still don't know what he was doing claiming a cop at the very end. To troll town?

Unvoting to tie it with more than 20 minutes to go in EOD2 is iffy, but it seemed like something Jamiet would do for the reason he said, and 20 minutes isn't nearly close enough for lunch for that to be a truly bad idea. But mostly, I've played a few games with Jamiet, when he has been both town and scum, and mostly I thought his reactions to the catfighting with you Brainbomb was his town reaction. Jamiet is more careful as scum, and while I'm not sure he and Brainbomb can help themselves, and while I'm not saying his scumplay is so great that he couldn't be bogged down in a fight with you, I thought it was more likely that was his town reaction. And as his wagon got closer to going through, his reactions looked townie to me; just like they apparently looked townie enough to you that you expressed doubt about his flip. I would have lynched Worcej and Brainbomb first, so I went with the preferable wagon that was available to me.

Reason why I put Jamie was townie was his apparent reaction after most of the votes were closed down. He didn't seem desperate to live. Seemed like "Fuck town I am going to flip my role to show them I was right" or something.

Now, what I still don't understand is how you put Jamie at a pretty strong town, even after all the suspicious activities he has done. The only reason you are giving me for town leaning Jamie is that 'it seems like what he would do' and so forth. Is there other legitimate reasons that made him look pretty town lean? I am just curious as to what you saw in him that made you doubt during the whole phase.

One more thing. While I do understand Brainbomb, can you explain your reasoning for Worcej?

Fourthly, I may have been wrong about you tunneling Jamiet. I think you might be tunneling yourself

The..what..? what does tunneling myself even mean? Like I am persuading other people to lynch me? I don't get it