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Cross-post. These are informal and nonbinding, but Im trying to be accurate. Im not counting the no-L because of the typo from Jamie's early game comments.

DrCJG (2) - Damo666, xy4
BancroftS (2) - Teacher 2, Sheep
XY (2) – Phil, DrCJC
Damo666 (1) - Worcej
Sheep (1) – Bancroft

@ Teacher it seems we are crossposting :) ... I have switched my vote to XY

Im debating whether to flip my vote to join my two strongest townreads now, or to leave it for better having the XY-Bancroft face off. Do you all have any thoughts?

FYI, Im soon (1pm eastern) to have to leave a desktop for the afternoon. As it turns out, my youngest has their school play today (he just changed classrooms, and they told me yesterday, grr). I will be on phone until deadline, and so can do brief posts, but not as much analysis.

Phil - no strong reads on anyone.

DrCJG yes I know the difference between UNVOTE and NO LYNCH. My reason for the NO LYNCH vote was to unvote you but also leave a parked vote just in case I didn't repost.

Apols for typo so .... ##VOTE NO LYNCH. As I said before I do not intend leaving the vote this way, will vote late in day when more info.

teacher, so long as you can still monitor the thread for a couple more hours, I feel like it's best to work on your own. Joining townreads is something I would keep for EoD, or even later days. The fewer degrees of separation the better.

DrCJG wrote: ↑

Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:04 pm

@ Sheep - What do you think of Teacher's belief that if Damo is scum there would have been some action to save him by now? The only real push to defend/save him seems to be this questioning by Teacher... is it to early to expect scum to start a movement or do you read this as indicative of him being town?

Well Phil you beat me to it... my read of Damo hasn't changed, but I am willing to give another wagon a shot.

##Vote Xy4

i dont think it would mean anything

damo has looked like there's a pretty strong chance of him being today's lynch

i think if he's scum the scumpartner might be afraid of being unable to save him and it looking bad via associations when he flips w

i would vote xy4 here to save drcjg and just to stop a no lynch even though i dont really have a good read on him

Alright, good luck my friends. Im on mobile and will be monitoring. My pool remains largely the same.

Informal, non-binding VC:
BancroftS (2) - Teacher2, Sheep
XY4 (2) – Phil, DrCJC
Damo666 (1) - Worcej
DrCJC (1) - xy4
Sheep (1) – Bancroft
No Lynch (1) - Damo

GM NOTE

I see you have all been busy voting.

I will be on soon to compile a vote count.

sheepsaysmeep wrote: ↑

Wed Jun 13, 2018 3:46 pm

suggesting cop hypoclaiming is fucking not alignment indicative at worst

it's the standard on all sites i play on because it helps town so much when executed even decently like saying im trying to hurt town by having them do it is nonsense

I dont know if this was a response to me or not, but it it was, it is a non-sequitur. My point in post 120 was not that you yourself suggested hypo (which I agree is NAI; it offers cops some cover but can help scum PR hunt, especially with newbs where the cover may not be good), but rather that you BOTH suggested it AND then threw shade on me for whether I "genuinely believed" it. It is the seeming contradiction here (and w/ readslists) that I found interesting.

teacher2 wrote: ↑

Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:18 pm

Im debating whether to flip my vote to join my two strongest townreads now, or to leave it for better having the XY-Bancroft face off. Do you all have any thoughts?

FYI, Im soon (1pm eastern) to have to leave a desktop for the afternoon. As it turns out, my youngest has their school play today (he just changed classrooms, and they told me yesterday, grr). I will be on phone until deadline, and so can do brief posts, but not as much analysis.

I saw this and intentionally waited to respond hoping to get some responses from others... sheep and phil were not the others I was looking for.

I think it is far too early to be joining a wagon just because it has someone you townread on it.... I hope you were just stating this to draw out comments because I found the suggestion a little scummy.

At this point (assuming you will have the ability to vote near EoD if you want to) I would look to vote for your preferred targets and particularly to keep interesting wagons at the forefront.

Hey I’m sorry I haven’t been posting lots and not very substantial stuff at that. This may have led to my receipt of two votes since I last checked.

Anyways, to defend myself on the CJG vote, I am starting to see more signs that he is scum. My initial reasons were not strong but I still felt it important to vote him. I believed (and still do) that he is trying to cover his tracks with trying to talk more and fully engage in all points of discussion. That sort of thing. It makes him seem more towny, but as I mentioned, I think it’s intentional.

My next point may also been seen as a weak reason, but bear with me. I think he voted me because of Phil doing so. Not saying Phil is scum, of course, his alignment is independent to this post. I think CJG voted for me to tie up the various wagons, and to hopefully convince another person to change to me.

I could be wrong about all of this, and I do apologise if so, but I don’t intend to change my vote just to get someone lynched. I strongly believe he is scum at this point. Will post a readlist soon.

@xy4 - I am glad to hear you are voting for me because you think I am scum.

I would like to understand better why you think me leaving a leading wagon on Damo to join another wagon that ties "up the various wagons" makes you think I am scum. Can you explain why a scum DrCJG would be more likely to make this switch in vote than a town DRCJG?

VOTE COUNT 1.5

xy4 (2) - phil_a_s, DrCJG
BancroftS (2) - Teacher2, Sheepsaysmeep
Sheepsaysmeep (1) - BancroftS
Damo666 (1) - Worcej
DrCJG (1) - xy4
No Lynch (1) - Damo666

Currently NOBODY is set to be lynched.

You have 4 hours and 47 minutes remaining in Day 1.

teacher2 wrote: ↑

Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:50 pm

sheepsaysmeep wrote: ↑

Wed Jun 13, 2018 3:46 pm

suggesting cop hypoclaiming is fucking not alignment indicative at worst

it's the standard on all sites i play on because it helps town so much when executed even decently like saying im trying to hurt town by having them do it is nonsense

I dont know if this was a response to me or not, but it it was, it is a non-sequitur. My point in post 120 was not that you yourself suggested hypo (which I agree is NAI; it offers cops some cover but can help scum PR hunt, especially with newbs where the cover may not be good), but rather that you BOTH suggested it AND then threw shade on me for whether I "genuinely believed" it. It is the seeming contradiction here (and w/ readslists) that I found interesting.

i dont read your posts the ones like that theyre too long

damo666 wrote: ↑

Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:48 am

Sheep - again as per Bancroft and his stressing of DrCJG as town has me suspicious. However, his advocacy of Fake Cop confuses me but maybe he knows that as this is a newbie game we may misuse and be of more help to scum?\

this part really annoys me

Teacher
Bancroft
Phil
CJG
Damo
Sheep
Worcej
Marneus
(For my reference dw!)

TOWN:

Sheep: Seems solid on his theorising so far. I feel like he’s a little of a reversal to how I feel about CJG. He’s being very assertive, which I would expect from someone who effectively has nothing to lose.

TOWN LEAN:

Teacher: I think he has lots of very good analysis to bring to the table. Gotten involved in every talking point, doesn’t attack people if they can’t exolain something, rather just gives them a nudge. Good contributor.

Worcej: Similar to Teacher, I think he’s been talking lots more recently and seems friendly.

NULL:

Bancroft: A lot of you want to see a face off between myself and this man. Unsure of what you mean, but I think Bancroft so far hasn’t set me off in either direction. Just.. neutral on him at the moment.

Damo: Nothing really to see here. He’d definitely be earlier on my list for scum than town, but I don’t want him anywhere near a lynch as of yet.

Marneus: A guy who hasn’t realised he’s in the game yet. Hey there!

SCUM LEAN:

Phil: Sorry buddy, but I still think he’s a little on the scum side. Unsure of what it is, and that’s why I won’t be voting for him this round certainly.

SCUM:

CJG: Uhh, I sorta already explained this but I definitely feel he’s scum. Look up if you haven’t read my previous post yet.

the two people are tied means no one is lynched rule is pretty dumb

I almost forgot I was going to look at Bancroft again. I have now, and I have not come back any wiser really. To me, Bancroft feels a bit like a strictly worse lynch than damo, on the grounds that damo is also a newbie, but has been scummier.

xy4, thanks for being around, though I certainly hope the fact that this occurred only after you started gaining traction in the votes is a complete coincidence. I see you are continuing with your assertion that towny (helpful) behavior is actually scummy because of WIFOM. Well, I don't think I'll be able to convince you it's not, I suppose, but I would like to note that penalizing people for talking and engaging is a terrible plan, since if no-one talks or engages, we'll never find the scum. Lastly, I also don't really understand the thing about DrCJG's vote change - damo666 was, even without me on it, the strongest lynch at the time.
However, both of these ideas are wrong, but not particularly scummy. I feel about you much the same way I did before.

bancroft has higher wolf equity but bancroft/damo lynches both work

sheep, I know the post is long, but read the goddam thread. I get the feeling from your style that you are actually being honest in the things you post, but that doesn't mean the honesty isn't self-censored. Missing critical information, perhaps.
You're still stuck at null for me, mostly because I feel like your level of activity and posting style are causing some false positives for me.
Could you give us a readlist, with either direct references to arguments, or arguments? Thanks.

xy4, interesting that you get the feeling that worcej has been talking recently. Looking at the list of worcej posts, it is not particularly long. What do you think gave you that idea? Is it a comparison against other posters? In general, your list is pretty vague.

worcej, speaking of which, you said you were working on a readlist? How's that going?