MAFIA 52: You Can't Take The Sky From Me [HIDDEN]

[Chaqa]

Claiming PR makes a NK more likely, not less.
Fakeclaiming PR makes a lynch almost inevitable.
The only people overly concerned with being reavered are people who hate playing scum (like myself), that does not seem to be the case with you from what you've been saying. And it is unclear why you would think that claiming PR would make you less vulnerable to being reavered.

So no, claiming PR makes very little sense for BH.

These are the obvious fakeclaims:

Roleblocker fakeclaims Companion
Investigator fakeclaims Reader
Agent fakeclaims VT
BH fakeclaims VT
RP fakeclaims something that won't get them lynched D1 so they have time to recruit. With the D1 claims of PR/VT that we did, this was claiming PR, because the idea was that we would lynch in the VT pool (as we did).

That's the obvious. The obvious is not always what happens, but so far there's no reason to suspect it is not what happened.

Ah, good, xorxes also called goldie out for his silly reasoning.

I agree with your obvious fake-claim reasoning. RB/Companion is the stupid obvious one. Investigator/Reader is a little more iffy - Investigator could also claim Doctor. Agent/BH as VT makes sense.

Reaper Prime is tricky... as I said, if I were RP, I would probably claim Doctor, but maybe VT as well.

It seems safe to assume Kalel is the Roleblocker and ND is actually the backup Companion as he claimed (forgettign Reaver shenanigans for the moment). This leaves:

Goldie -> Investigator/Reaper Prime/Bounty Hunter
worcej -> Bounty Hunter/Reaper Prime/Investigator
{EMC/Chaqa/Fox/Bozo} -> Agent/Bounty Hunter

This is kinda where I'm thinking. We can hopefully have Damo take another crack at scanning within the VT group - mafia are unlikely to kill him if only their Agent is within that group, they would probably rather focus on players who can catch them (like they did with Dargo).

To me that says we should really go for an information lynch in Goldie or worcej, though I don't see anything necessarily wrong with lynching Kalel as confirmed Alliance scum.

What information do we gain by lynching goldie?

If we're correct that he is RP, how do we prevent Reaver2 from recruiting Reaver3 on N3?

Damo is not the only PR that the roleblocker can mess with. If he roleblocked me and dargo had not watched me, I would be under suspicion of being reavered.

If he roleblocks dargo, we lose important info.

If he roleblocks Jamie or Tom, we lose protection.

Why don't you care about any of this?

I guess I'm just not super concerned with any PR deaths, because I'm pretty sure a few of you have been Reaver'd. I guess it's a strong enough reasoning to vote out Kalel, though.

##Vote Kalel

[dargorygel]

I think Goldie is RP. He's squirming skillfully, but pinning him down and hoping we're right seems unnecessary. The M1 team can't change the game circumstances. RP can. Now obviously, if the rp is pinned, he can't change anything. But while I am confident that Goldie Reaves, we can't be sure till he's dead. If we are wrong, the secret reaver team grows every night.

Kill the vermin.

No, if we are wrong, Reavers are already 3, and now they start killing. Killing goldie before Kalel does not help us.

If we are right, we should not kill him until we know who reaver2 is. We can stop them from recruiting anyone else only if we know who they are first.

The mistake I keep thinking is that reavers have no end to their growth.
##vote kalel

[goldfinger0303]

My question is why would you claim PR as the BH? That did make it inevitable that you would be caught.

Why is getting caught a concern where I have a role that doesn't need to be lynched by town? My biggest concern isn't a town lynch, but an accidental NK or reaver.

It is more likely that town will have to lynch the BH before he can win. Also, if I was the BH, I think I would welcome becoming a Reaver.

That's playing against my wincon then

[goldfinger0303]

Thank you all for ##vote Kalel. His bounty coming in should clear me and pin worcej

[Chaqa]

Thank you all for ##vote Kalel. His bounty coming in should clear me and pin worcej

We're still gonna lynch you, most likely.

[ND]

##vote kalel

See how this turns out.

[KalelChase]

##Vote Kalel

##Hammer

[Foxcastle]

##VOTE KALEL

[teacon7]

Thought: Chaqa might be bh

What information do we gain by lynching goldie?

Idk, but Chaqa might have information we don't, and wants us to find out. If Chaqa is bh, for example, he KNOWS gold is scum. Or just a bounty.

If we're correct that he is RP, how do we prevent Reaver2 from recruiting Reaver3 on N3?

Pilot him. Or did I misread that he commuted someone too soon ago? I like the idea of piloting dangerous prices to leave them out of play. If we use the pilot for protection, it also loses us utility. Piloting gold works whether he's mafia or reaver. It only doesnt-matter if he's BH.

[Chaqa]

I'll leave the decision to hammer or not to the town clears.

I don't see any reason not to, but that's just me.

[Chaqa]

Thought: Chaqa might be bh

What information do we gain by lynching goldie?

Idk, but Chaqa might have information we don't, and wants us to find out. If Chaqa is bh, for example, he KNOWS gold is scum. Or just a bounty.

If we're correct that he is RP, how do we prevent Reaver2 from recruiting Reaver3 on N3?

Pilot him. Or did I misread that he commuted someone too soon ago? I like the idea of piloting dangerous prices to leave them out of play. If we use the pilot for protection, it also loses us utility. Piloting gold works whether he's mafia or reaver. It only doesnt-matter if he's BH.

If I were BH, I would have claimed to try to come to an arrangement with town.

[KalelChase]

##End

Has anyone ever been voted out unanimously? If not I guess I could get close to that.

It's been swell, folks. Not sure Mafia ever had a chance, and next to mental geniuses like ND and Xorx, and creatives like Bunny I was completely outmatched.

I've never been voted out before, so this will be a new experience. I'm pretty sure my buddies have not been Reavered, so I wish them luck. If Maf can't win then I always root for Bunny... Excelsior.

[Jamiet99uk]

Hello everyone, I just caught up. That Goldfinger spam was confusing for a moment.

It seems you want to leave Goldfinger for tomorrow. A shame, but okay.

##VOTE KALELCHASE
##END

[Jamiet99uk]

Has anyone ever been voted out unanimously? If not I guess I could get close to that.

Yes it has happened a few times.

[xorxes]

Thought: Chaqa might be bh

What information do we gain by lynching goldie?

Idk, but Chaqa might have information we don't, and wants us to find out. If Chaqa is bh, for example, he KNOWS gold is scum. Or just a bounty.

If we're correct that he is RP, how do we prevent Reaver2 from recruiting Reaver3 on N3?

Pilot him. Or did I misread that he commuted someone too soon ago? I like the idea of piloting dangerous prices to leave them out of play. If we use the pilot for protection, it also loses us utility. Piloting gold works whether he's mafia or reaver. It only doesnt-matter if he's BH.

Pilot who? We don't know who Reaver2 is yes. If we kill Prime before we know who River2 is, we can't stop River2 from recruiting.

[xorxes]

We're not hammering before damo has sent his read order.

[Chaqa]

We're not hammering before damo has sent his read order.

At what point does it become more valuable to re-scan PRs who are likely Reavers?

i.e. - teacon

[teacon7]

Thought: Chaqa might be bh

What information do we gain by lynching goldie?

Idk, but Chaqa might have information we don't, and wants us to find out. If Chaqa is bh, for example, he KNOWS gold is scum. Or just a bounty.

If we're correct that he is RP, how do we prevent Reaver2 from recruiting Reaver3 on N3?

Pilot him. Or did I misread that he commuted someone too soon ago? I like the idea of piloting dangerous prices to leave them out of play. If we use the pilot for protection, it also loses us utility. Piloting gold works whether he's mafia or reaver. It only doesnt-matter if he's BH.

Pilot who? We don't know who Reaver2 is yes. If we kill Prime before we know who River2 is, we can't stop River2 from recruiting.

Sorry for shortness - I'm on mobile most of today. I meant that piloting goldfinger would remove the concern from Chaqa's mind that reaver!gold is dangerous. A piloted reaver prime doesn't recruit, nor does he pass off his power. It helps also of gold is mafia. Pointless waste if gold is bh. The fact that Chaqa wants to lynch gold says either a) he's reasonably certain that gold isn't bh and therefore good possiblity of being reaver prime, or b) Chaqa is bh and arguing for a particular lunch because gold is a bointy. Ergo I inferred that Chaqa might be BH

[dargorygel]

Has anyone ever been voted out unanimously? If not I guess I could get close to that.

Yes it has happened a few times.

Most recently, when the room refused to believe the completely rational explanation for the stupid thing I did when I was scum.

[Chaqa]

Has anyone ever been voted out unanimously? If not I guess I could get close to that.

Yes it has happened a few times.

Most recently, when the room refused to believe the completely rational explanation for the stupid thing I did when I was scum.

Was this the game when I explicitly told you to do X, and you did Y?