Mafia 47 - The Sixth Mass Extinction - GAME THREAD [HIDDEN]

[Jamiet99uk]

I want people to respond to my Espresso case.
I think he's scum and he slipped.

If you don't agree, let me know why.

It is possible EspressoPatronum thought there were only 5 scum roles, as he said. However, since he has been talking about the power thief and janitor, I would expect him to understand all of the mafia roles.

Yes. He appeared to know how all the Mafia roles work. I think he just forgot that town didn't know a Janitor wasn't in play... which points to him being scum who knows there is a Janitor.

[EspressoPatronum]

I want people to respond to my Espresso case.
I think he's scum and he slipped.

If you don't agree, let me know why.

It is possible EspressoPatronum thought there were only 5 scum roles, as he said. However, since he has been talking about the power thief and janitor, I would expect him to understand all of the mafia roles.

I've been focused on the content of the roles + overlooked their distribution.

[Jamiet99uk]

I will today lynch:

- Espresso: For the reason I've clearly and repeatedly articulated, which most people are weirdly ignoring,

Or

- Xorxes: His push on me is fake, had its origins in a false narrative, does not evolve in the face of new information. In addition his hounding of the Masons was rather scummy.

I've never seen someone rationalize their OMGUS reads more that you're doing now, Jamie.

You asked why I thought your DP self-target was bad + you tunneled on my janitor assumption instead of addressing my answer.

My read on you is absolutely not OMGUS.
I am scumreading you for reasons unrelated to your claimed scumread on me.

[Jamiet99uk]

Second, I purport that [EP's] DP smokescreen was an actual attempt to identify the real DP, to help Mafia select their NKs.

Please explain your reasoning.

The entire point of the smokescreen is to mask the actual role without them having to reveal.

Yes but if my theory is correct YOU KNOW WHO THE JANITOR IS.

Thus anyone who announces their DP target was the person you know to be the Janitor is in your real DP pool, and if only one person declares that target, then BANG, you got them.

This is another reason why smokescreen are not without risk. They can still be informative to scum, based on scum's other information.

[bozotheclown]

No it doesn't. Percy's, damo's and Chaqa's roles are not among the directly provable. They have no bearing on what I'm saying.

Let's try again.

Plan A- Everyone has to claim their role D1.

Plan B- Masons, Vig, Votestealer, Inno Child, Bulletproof have to claim their role D1, everyone else doesn't.

Which plan do you think is better? Do you see any benefits of Plan A that Plan B doesn't have? Do you see any benefits of Plan B that Plan A doesn't have?

I understand the benefit/drawbacks of the verifiable roles claiming, I am talking about the benefit of forcing all of the scum to claim their roles D1 without coordinating with each other. For instance, if damo is scum, he was able to imply an important town role to avoid getting shot, because there was an important town role on the scum list. If Percy is scum, he was able to avoid getting lynched because he claimed another valuable town role. Maybe you are scum and chose a role that would not be resolved until D7. So, maybe Percy's, damo's and Chaqa's roles do not have a bearing on what you are saying, but they do on what I am saying.

If I claim inno child then either:

(A) I am inno child
(B) Inno child is in the scum fake list

So how does forcing me and everyone else to claim help town?

Also, If Inno child is in the fake list, why do I claim it for myself instead of leaving it available for whichever of my teammates needs it most at the most convenient time? Do you think I'm that selfish as a team player?

If the scum had been forced to claim their 5 fake roles before anyone was threatened to be shot or lynched, then maybe Percy, if he is scum, would have been forced to claim VT and not be able to claim a valuable town role at EOD. This is just an example, but I think it conveys my point.

It is possible we could have derived other information from forcing the scum to claim their roles D1, as they would have had to be careful to not claim the same roles. If it had been possible to force everyone to claim their role at the same time, this benefit would be obvious. As an example of something that was possible, we could tell everyone a time to try to get online and claim their role. If a significant number of players participated, we would have some likely town clears.

I do not think you are mafia, but if you are, it is possible the mafia team decided N1 that your claiming inno child was the best use of that fake role. That would not mean you are not a team player.

[EspressoPatronum]

Second, I purport that [EP's] DP smokescreen was an actual attempt to identify the real DP, to help Mafia select their NKs.

Please explain your reasoning.

The entire point of the smokescreen is to mask the actual role without them having to reveal.

Yes but if my theory is correct YOU KNOW WHO THE JANITOR IS.

Thus anyone who announces their DP target was the person you know to be the Janitor is in your real DP pool, and if only one person declares that target, then BANG, you got them.

This is another reason why smokescreen are not without risk. They can still be informative to scum, based on scum's other information.

That would be a fantastic result for town. By killing the only person with the janitor target, maf is effectively telling the town that the DP was correct.

I'd trade DP for a scum hit any day.

[Jamiet99uk]

Second, I purport that [EP's] DP smokescreen was an actual attempt to identify the real DP, to help Mafia select their NKs.

Please explain your reasoning.

The entire point of the smokescreen is to mask the actual role without them having to reveal.

Yes but if my theory is correct YOU KNOW WHO THE JANITOR IS.

Thus anyone who announces their DP target was the person you know to be the Janitor is in your real DP pool, and if only one person declares that target, then BANG, you got them.

This is another reason why smokescreen are not without risk. They can still be informative to scum, based on scum's other information.

To elaborate, assume ZULTAR is the JANITOR.
You are on Zultar's team and you know he was planning to Janitor Vecna.
You observe that the Janitoring failed.
You call for a smokescreen of DP claims.
Everyone responds.
Only DAVE claims that he DPed ZULTAR.

Bingo! Dave is probably the DP.

[dargorygel]

Things I kinda liked in the overnight:
worcej's opening comment of his drunk tirade. Mechanics vs. motivation. Worcej, do you read Agatha Christie?
Jamie's espresso deduction. Prime Jamie stuff.
But today's wagons are Vaporwave or bozo.
Both of which are swimming in the scumpool.
Vapor's expression of his inner soul reminds me a lot of MY defenses when I have been scum. Although I am unsure of what aTe stands for.
##VOTE VAPORWAVE

[worcej]

don't drink and play mafia

Oof... can’t argue with this one. Being half way across the country and in a hotel leaves limited options...

[Jamiet99uk]

Please explain your reasoning.

The entire point of the smokescreen is to mask the actual role without them having to reveal.

Yes but if my theory is correct YOU KNOW WHO THE JANITOR IS.

Thus anyone who announces their DP target was the person you know to be the Janitor is in your real DP pool, and if only one person declares that target, then BANG, you got them.

This is another reason why smokescreen are not without risk. They can still be informative to scum, based on scum's other information.

That would be a fantastic result for town. By killing the only person with the janitor target, maf is effectively telling the town that the DP was correct.

I'd trade DP for a scum hit any day.

No but likewise it allows you to rule them out and for the time being NK people who still have powers to use.

[worcej]

Things I kinda liked in the overnight:
worcej's opening comment of his drunk tirade. Mechanics vs. motivation. Worcej, do you read Agatha Christie?
Jamie's espresso deduction. Prime Jamie stuff.
But today's wagons are Vaporwave or bozo.
Both of which are swimming in the scumpool.
Vapor's expression of his inner soul reminds me a lot of MY defenses when I have been scum. Although I am unsure of what aTe stands for.
##VOTE VAPORWAVE

No I do not.

[dargorygel]

@espresso
What reasons do you perceive that either scum OR town might not be honest in their DP choice? Do you assume that town would be honest?

[bozotheclown]

Second, I purport that [EP's] DP smokescreen was an actual attempt to identify the real DP, to help Mafia select their NKs.

Please explain your reasoning.

The entire point of the smokescreen is to mask the actual role without them having to reveal.

Yes but if my theory is correct YOU KNOW WHO THE JANITOR IS.

Thus anyone who announces their DP target was the person you know to be the Janitor is in your real DP pool, and if only one person declares that target, then BANG, you got them.

This is another reason why smokescreen are not without risk. They can still be informative to scum, based on scum's other information.

There is not much value in the scum identifying the DP, since he no longer has any power. All it would do would narrow down the pool for other town roles.

[EspressoPatronum]

Yes but if my theory is correct YOU KNOW WHO THE JANITOR IS.

Thus anyone who announces their DP target was the person you know to be the Janitor is in your real DP pool, and if only one person declares that target, then BANG, you got them.

This is another reason why smokescreen are not without risk. They can still be informative to scum, based on scum's other information.

That would be a fantastic result for town. By killing the only person with the janitor target, maf is effectively telling the town that the DP was correct.

I'd trade DP for a scum hit any day.

No but likewise it allows you to rule them out and for the time being NK people who still have powers to use.

Ah, I see what you're saying.

Yes, that's the small downside of the smokescreen. As I explained to xorxes earlier, you run this risk as a trade-off to ensure town receives the information no matter what.

[worcej]

Also, the categories for the post were from the following:

Geometry: damo
Aeronotical Eng: Jamie
Poem: Xorxes
QT: EP

None are actually verified, but at least they used 4 people to really prove that it wasn't a 5-man effort.

Huh. worcej went from lucid to drunk AF between the above post and this post:

What's your favorite color?

BLUE. IT REMINDS ME OF WATER, WHICH IS COOL. ALL MY FISH TANKS ARE PAINTED BLUE, BUT ONLY JAMIE KNOWS THIS BECAUSE WE'RE FB FRIENDS AND SHIT.

18 minutes... worcej, are you a sophomore girl?

I don’t think I was lucid at any point of typing that, because thst was a lot of effort that was already made if I would’ve just read other posts..

[dargorygel]

Things I kinda liked in the overnight:
worcej's opening comment of his drunk tirade. Mechanics vs. motivation. Worcej, do you read Agatha Christie?
Jamie's espresso deduction. Prime Jamie stuff.
But today's wagons are Vaporwave or bozo.
Both of which are swimming in the scumpool.
Vapor's expression of his inner soul reminds me a lot of MY defenses when I have been scum. Although I am unsure of what aTe stands for.
##VOTE VAPORWAVE

No I do not.

Your point is Poirot's point in ever Hercule Poirot tale. Not sure that now is the time to discuss this... but maybe it is. You make a good point imo.
We look at mechanics when we don't have anything else. And then we get locked in that. What, concretely, do you recommend we do?

[EspressoPatronum]

@espresso
What reasons do you perceive that either scum OR town might not be honest in their DP choice? Do you assume that town would be honest?

Town DP not being honest with their target would be terrible for town. Imagine if the DP lied in the smokescreen, died before they could actually reveal, then the town was left with their fake target and treated it as legitimate.

Everyone else but a real DP is necessarily lying in their smokescreen result.

[foodcoats]

Things I kinda liked in the overnight:
worcej's opening comment of his drunk tirade. Mechanics vs. motivation. Worcej, do you read Agatha Christie?
Jamie's espresso deduction. Prime Jamie stuff.
But today's wagons are Vaporwave or bozo.
Both of which are swimming in the scumpool.
Vapor's expression of his inner soul reminds me a lot of MY defenses when I have been scum. Although I am unsure of what aTe stands for.
##VOTE VAPORWAVE

No I do not.

Your point is Poirot's point in ever Hercule Poirot tale. Not sure that now is the time to discuss this... but maybe it is. You make a good point imo.
We look at mechanics when we don't have anything else. And then we get locked in that. What, concretely, do you recommend we do?

I'm still a bit chuffed at drunk!worcej calling me ass, but this is a good point. All the mechanical discussion feels like a bit of a smokescreen, as it were...

[worcej]

13/17 reporting:
bozo: dargorygel, bo_sox, worcej, Vapor, Percy
xorxes: Jamie, flash, EspressoPatronum, dargorygel, bo_sox
brainbomb: bozo, flash, bo_sox, damo, dargorygel
Jamie: Chaqa, dargorygel, flash, foodcoats, xorxes
damo: dargorygel, flash, EspressoPatronum, bo_sox, worcej
Foxcastle: Percy, emc, damo, Vapor, Chaqa
Vapor: bo_sox, Chaqa, dargorygel, emc, Jamie
flash: Percy, bo_sox, xorxes, emc, worcej
rdrivera: bozo, foodcoats, flash, worcej, bo_sox
worcej: Vapor, Hosuke, dargorygel, Chaqa, foodcoats
EspressoPatronum: damo, emc, Percy, xorxes, worcej
Chaqa: bozo, bo_sox, dargorygel, Percy, flash/Vapor
Hosuke: flash, bo_sox, Percy, dargorygel, Chaqa
bo_sox:
dargorygel:
foodcoats:
Percy:

bozo: 3
bo_sox: 9
brainbomb: 0
Chaqa: 5
damo: 3
dargorygel: 9
emc: 4
EspressoPatronum : 2
flash: 6.5
foodcoats: 3
Foxcastle: 0
ItsHosuke: 1
Jamie: 2
Percy: 6
rdrivera: 0
Vapor: 3.5
worcej: 5
xorxes: 3

I am going to stop updating this list. I thought it might be useful to get everyone on record, maybe it will help when we start lynching scum.

This is odd we have darg and bo joint top of polls yet nobody is voting bo and I'm the only one on darg

Not to be the jack wagon that pokes holes in all of bozo’s attempts, but the problem with this list and just lynching the top people is that 5 lists are fake and said fake lists could be compiled purposely to try to add more votes to certain stacks.

[worcej]

This will be a smal AtE moment so skip it those of you that can't stand this sort of thing

It's not my first time to be honest with everything and have things turn against me, completely opposite of my intent

When I'm town I wanna offer information however it has been proven that it's best to be secretive even then

Everything is suspicious and people are not ready to accept claims at face value, especially not mine so...

I make a public promise that if a lynch on me will happen this day, I plan to NEVER claim any actions performed on me or results in upcoming games

After having negative motives attributed to my revealing of stuff too many times, I will refrain from doing so in future situations.

Thanks for understanding me and have a nice day

Explain why you would be role blocked.