Re: Mafia 47 - The Sixth Mass Extinction, Sign Ups
Posted: Sun Jul 14, 2019 7:45 am
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I fully endorse what Worcej is saying.worcej wrote: ↑Sun Jul 14, 2019 3:52 amIt's extreme, but we've established it's not against the rules. So you are litigating an opinion and not an actual rule at this point. Sorry, but that's how tyranny begins.TrPrado wrote: ↑Sun Jul 14, 2019 3:48 amI've experienced all of these other things and not a single one of them has made any player afraid that we might have to abandon the game entirely. Chippe's case was extreme no matter how it's sliced.worcej wrote: ↑Sun Jul 14, 2019 3:41 amOkay, what game hasn't had a period of derailment due to a player?
Have you not experienced a brain spam?
Have you not experienced a Jamie freak out?
Have you not experienced a Durga stirring up shit session?
Have you not experienced an ND yelling that everyone are morons?
Great, you and Neph have a personal view and apparently you guys are going forward with excluding Chippe. But I hope everyone else here who is okay with how you're doing this is okay that I am going to make sure I exclude Durga from any game I GM because I think numerous player conflicts are centered around her for how she posts. I'll also make sure to not allow MF to join because of how often he lurks, which creates a negative player experience for numerous people and sometimes requires a sub-out because of it.
You guys going to be okay with me doing that down the road? I'll be the GM, so I can do what I want right?
Are you guys beginning to see why this is a really poor precedent yet?
M46 went off fine and Chippe did not effect the game in a way that it will be abandoned. Your public lynching of him is unreasonable and you should've been okay with the fact he told both of you he wouldn't do it again.
I am probably not playing in any game that you GM anyway, but if you ask him to comply for a reasonable request (like Moscow say in tbe thread he won't lurk) and they don't agree I believe it's in your right to not allow them. It's not because the last game, but about his failure to accept GM authority.worcej wrote: ↑Sun Jul 14, 2019 3:44 amSpecifically @rdr and @darg - I will not allow Durga or MF in any future game of mine because of poor player experiences that I've witnessed others experience and even express to me.
You guys okay with that? You'll still play right? I can do what I want and you'll respect that right?
My gut tells me you won't be okay with that and the only reason you're okay with it now is because it's Chippe.
Here is probably the main point where we disagree. We can't set rules for all situations that arise, that why GM have the final word. And there are some unwritten rules like trying to keep the game pleasant to everyone involved.worcej wrote: ↑Sun Jul 14, 2019 3:48 amFor the record - I will never exclude anyone from my games, the previous posts are an example of acceptable decisions I can make down the road. I just want to hear it as being okay from the group of people who are all saying this is okay for you to do. If it's okay now, it's okay down the road.
More 2cents - As a GM, you should be trying to ensure people play within the rules, not play how you want them to. Player experience is critical, but how people play their game is not something you have control of. Just because people don't like Chippe doesn't mean he shouldn't play. Let them D1 lynch his ass if they don't like him.
is this our current list?TrPrado wrote: ↑Sat Jul 13, 2019 11:54 pmPlayers
1. Durga - CONFIRMED
2. foodcoats - CONFIRMED
3. EspressoPatronum - CONFIRMED
4. Vaporwave - CONFIRMED
5. worcej - CONFIRMED
6. Percy Williams - CONFIRMED
7. damo - CONFIRMED
8. Jamiet99uk - CONFIRMED
9. Vecna - CONFIRMED
10. rdrivera2005 - CONFIRMED
11. xorxes - CONFIRMED
12. bozo - CONFIRMED
13. FlaviusAetius - CONFIRMED
14. Flash2015 - CONFIRMED
15. bo_sox48 - CONFIRMED
16. Dargorygel - CONFIRMED
17. Foxcastle - CONFIRMED
18. EMC - CONFIRMED
19. Mike213 - CONFIRMED
20. Fluminator - CONFIRMED
21. brainbomb CONFIRMED
24.
25.
26.
27.
28.
Substitutes:
1. MoscowFleet
2. ItsHosuke
And I respect your choice in choosing to not play a game I lead, that's your call to make.rdrivera2005 wrote: ↑Sun Jul 14, 2019 10:44 amI am probably not playing in any game that you GM anyway, but if you ask him to comply for a reasonable request (like Moscow say in tbe thread he won't lurk) and they don't agree I believe it's in your right to not allow them. It's not because the last game, but about his failure to accept GM authority.worcej wrote: ↑Sun Jul 14, 2019 3:44 amSpecifically @rdr and @darg - I will not allow Durga or MF in any future game of mine because of poor player experiences that I've witnessed others experience and even express to me.
You guys okay with that? You'll still play right? I can do what I want and you'll respect that right?
My gut tells me you won't be okay with that and the only reason you're okay with it now is because it's Chippe.
Right, and as I said to rdr, the 4 who will drop out if Chippe plays are making their own personal choice. Chippe's choice to not play was forced upon him. That is an important distinction, at least in my eyes.
Excellent! I am glad to take that blame! I made a call and I knew some people wouldn't like, but respected that Chippe wanted to play that way. I made sure it wouldn't be rules breaking (which we've established it wasn't) and that should be that. So why are we barring Chippe from this game again?rdrivera2005 wrote: ↑Sun Jul 14, 2019 10:58 amHere is probably the main point where we disagree. We can't set rules for all situations that arise, that why GM have the final word. And there are some unwritten rules like trying to keep the game pleasant to everyone involved.worcej wrote: ↑Sun Jul 14, 2019 3:48 amFor the record - I will never exclude anyone from my games, the previous posts are an example of acceptable decisions I can make down the road. I just want to hear it as being okay from the group of people who are all saying this is okay for you to do. If it's okay now, it's okay down the road.
More 2cents - As a GM, you should be trying to ensure people play within the rules, not play how you want them to. Player experience is critical, but how people play their game is not something you have control of. Just because people don't like Chippe doesn't mean he shouldn't play. Let them D1 lynch his ass if they don't like him.
I honestly don't blame Chippe for the last game shenanigans. The blame to me was on you and Jamiet allowing him to go through that path. He asked you and you considered valid a tactic that question the game integrity to get a result, this is pure angleshooting like Squigs (and Carl I think ) pointed and it shouldn't be allowed. But that was your game and your choice.
I believe I fixed it.Vaporwave wrote: ↑Sun Jul 14, 2019 2:04 pmis this our current list?TrPrado wrote: ↑Sat Jul 13, 2019 11:54 pmPlayers
1. Durga - CONFIRMED
2. foodcoats - CONFIRMED
3. EspressoPatronum - CONFIRMED
4. Vaporwave - CONFIRMED
5. Percy Williams - CONFIRMED
6. damo - CONFIRMED
7. Vecna - CONFIRMED
8. rdrivera2005 - CONFIRMED
9. xorxes - CONFIRMED
10. bozo - CONFIRMED
11. FlaviusAetius - CONFIRMED
12. Flash2015 - CONFIRMED
13. bo_sox48 - CONFIRMED
14. Dargorygel - CONFIRMED
15. Foxcastle - CONFIRMED
16. EMC - CONFIRMED
17. Mike213 - CONFIRMED
18. Fluminator - CONFIRMED
19. brainbomb CONFIRMED
24.
25.
26.
27.
28.
Substitutes:
1. MoscowFleet
2. ItsHosuke
Just to be clear, I don't have any problem playing with Chippe and signed for the game with him on it. If he does what GM ask I would have no issues. I just think GM request was reasonable and if they request me to do the same I would without any problem. He just failed to have any cortesy with GMs and seems to just seek confrontation (and is succeeding).worcej wrote: ↑Sun Jul 14, 2019 2:24 pmExcellent! I am glad to take that blame! I made a call and I knew some people wouldn't like, but respected that Chippe wanted to play that way. I made sure it wouldn't be rules breaking (which we've established it wasn't) and that should be that. So why are we barring Chippe from this game again?rdrivera2005 wrote: ↑Sun Jul 14, 2019 10:58 amHere is probably the main point where we disagree. We can't set rules for all situations that arise, that why GM have the final word. And there are some unwritten rules like trying to keep the game pleasant to everyone involved.worcej wrote: ↑Sun Jul 14, 2019 3:48 amFor the record - I will never exclude anyone from my games, the previous posts are an example of acceptable decisions I can make down the road. I just want to hear it as being okay from the group of people who are all saying this is okay for you to do. If it's okay now, it's okay down the road.
More 2cents - As a GM, you should be trying to ensure people play within the rules, not play how you want them to. Player experience is critical, but how people play their game is not something you have control of. Just because people don't like Chippe doesn't mean he shouldn't play. Let them D1 lynch his ass if they don't like him.
I honestly don't blame Chippe for the last game shenanigans. The blame to me was on you and Jamiet allowing him to go through that path. He asked you and you considered valid a tactic that question the game integrity to get a result, this is pure angleshooting like Squigs (and Carl I think ) pointed and it shouldn't be allowed. But that was your game and your choice.
GMs have the final word, but we're not playing yet. What rules need to be enforced now to warrant someone being kicked out of a game?
shame on you for wanting attention in these tense moments and shame on me for taking your bait
You know whats ironic about this, WORCEJ AND JAMIE's authority from last game is being questioned HERE.rdrivera2005 wrote: ↑Sun Jul 14, 2019 10:44 amI am probably not playing in any game that you GM anyway, but if you ask him to comply for a reasonable request (like Moscow say in tbe thread he won't lurk) and they don't agree I believe it's in your right to not allow them. It's not because the last game, but about his failure to accept GM authority.worcej wrote: ↑Sun Jul 14, 2019 3:44 amSpecifically @rdr and @darg - I will not allow Durga or MF in any future game of mine because of poor player experiences that I've witnessed others experience and even express to me.
You guys okay with that? You'll still play right? I can do what I want and you'll respect that right?
My gut tells me you won't be okay with that and the only reason you're okay with it now is because it's Chippe.