Mafia 46 - Ace Attorney - GAME THREAD

[ChippeRock]

##UNVOTE in my late night thoughts I remembered the second criterion of How to Read New Players 101 and realized I may have blown my load a bit early. The first criterion I think I can explain earlier than the second. But now for that sleep.

First you instantly jump onto a noob's wagon the INSTANT ND jumps on his wagon and staunchly defend your vote. Now you claim to have realized that you jumped onto that wagon too quick and you will reconsider?

Why didn't you exercise caution when you started feeling Cruaader was scum? Why did you throw that to the wind the moment ND jumped on his wagon?

I don't like this impulsiveness, and my suspicions about you & ND being partners-in-scum are coming back. I'm switching my vote back to you. ##VOTE TrPrado

[rdrivera2005]

@rdrivera, sheep me on Flavius please.

Could you present me a better reason then "Secretary" told him Balki is experienced and clever"? I don't buy this and Fox voting him make me less inclined to follow on it.

[ChippeRock]

@MoscowFleet, seeing as you're suddenly browsing this forum again after your absence, I think all of us would like to hear your thoughts, opinions, & reads.

[Foxcastle]

So, I am 12 pages behind on thread and have a though schedule at work today, so I will cast a ##vote Foxcastle.

I feel I miss answering someone yesterday, but can't look at it right now, so if you (whoever you are) want a fast answer please ask again.

Is this your gut feeling, still? You've read 43 pages and that's what you've got? LAZY

Not only, but of course it has a part on it. I dislike your no joke phase, but not posting anything of substance until page 29.
I don't like your comment about ND and Durga and calling ND a good player (seems like baiting or buddying or both).
I don't like you did not vote (a bit hipocrite on my part I know).
I don't like your comment about not reading your own game, which is obviously a low.
I don't like your questioning without following.
I dunt like your GM call for an obvious thing.

This is also lazy?

Doing the work after is not lazy, no. But doing it after you've been called on it is a post hoc fallacy.

And I've explained most of those things, or they are nonsense.

You want good content early on in a game this big? It must be nice to want things. But I was mostly serious about avoiding a joke phase, not because I think it would lead to better content, but to avoid trash cluttering the thread. There is a lead-up period where it's just players standing around talking, and yeah, it's gonna be a slow start.

ND is a competent player, and he respects the game. There's plenty to dislike about ND, but that's good enough to get him to "good" in my book. You don't find it odd that they have raging fights for no reason in most other games, but given the opportunity, decide to take the high road here?

I explained my reading of my own game in response to ND's question. Even if you want to take the worst reading of that, that makes me a bad GM in the last game, not scum in this one.

I guess I can't push back on your opinion of my play style. You're entitled to your opinions.

I am not familiar with the flavor text and am not particularly interested in getting familiar with it. It was easier to just get a clarification.

[MoscowFleet]

Sorry folks - I’m in England visiting my uncle, flight just landed at Gatwick two hours ago. Dead tired and going to bed right now, but at least phase timings are more convenient now.

##vote Flav as policy. Either he’s scum or, no offense, useless town.

[rdrivera2005]

As I already explained last game, I don't like policy lynch lurkers D1, but if Moscow don't show or get replaced I will push his lynch D2 (if I am still alive, of course).

[rdrivera2005]

Sorry folks - I’m in England visiting my uncle, flight just landed at Gatwick two hours ago. Dead tired and going to bed right now, but at least phase timings are more convenient now.

##vote Flav as policy. Either he’s scum or, no offense, useless town.

And now he appears, how convenient.

[Foxcastle]

As I already explained last game, I don't like policy lynch lurkers D1, but if Moscow don't show or get replaced I will push his lynch D2 (if I am still alive, of course).

What makes you think you wouldn't be?

[rdrivera2005]

Is this your gut feeling, still? You've read 43 pages and that's what you've got? LAZY

Not only, but of course it has a part on it. I dislike your no joke phase, but not posting anything of substance until page 29.
I don't like your comment about ND and Durga and calling ND a good player (seems like baiting or buddying or both).
I don't like you did not vote (a bit hipocrite on my part I know).
I don't like your comment about not reading your own game, which is obviously a low.
I don't like your questioning without following.
I dunt like your GM call for an obvious thing.

This is also lazy?

Doing the work after is not lazy, no. But doing it after you've been called on it is a post hoc fallacy.

And I've explained most of those things, or they are nonsense.

You want good content early on in a game this big? It must be nice to want things. But I was mostly serious about avoiding a joke phase, not because I think it would lead to better content, but to avoid trash cluttering the thread. There is a lead-up period where it's just players standing around talking, and yeah, it's gonna be a slow start.

ND is a competent player, and he respects the game. There's plenty to dislike about ND, but that's good enough to get him to "good" in my book. You don't find it odd that they have raging fights for no reason in most other games, but given the opportunity, decide to take the high road here?

I explained my reading of my own game in response to ND's question. Even if you want to take the worst reading of that, that makes me a bad GM in the last game, not scum in this one.

I guess I can't push back on your opinion of my play style. You're entitled to your opinions.

I am not familiar with the flavor text and am not particularly interested in getting familiar with it. It was easier to just get a clarification.

I can agree I have been a bit lazy, a game rhis big is hard to me to keep updated.

I don't want content this early and I don't pretend I have 100% reads on anyone, but this makes me think jokes are as good as anything to sense the players on D1.

I saw your explanation about your game and this makes more sense then what I have got before.

Not moving my vote right now because I don't have a better guess. I have Tom and Bozo on my radar, but I don't think Tom is a good D1 lynch and Bozo is more on a lurker side (and I am usually wrong about him). Squigs have improved and he is now out of scum range.

[rdrivera2005]

As I already explained last game, I don't like policy lynch lurkers D1, but if Moscow don't show or get replaced I will push his lynch D2 (if I am still alive, of course).

What makes you think you wouldn't be?

We have a lynch (which is unlikely considering I have no vote, but not impossible) and possibly three NKs. And I was NKed N1 last game, so it's not that unlikely.

[ChippeRock]

QUESTIONS:

When and why did you start thinking I was scum?
When and why did you start thinking ND was scum?
Why are you so sure that Cruaader is town that you're seemingly willing to make scum reads based off of it?
Do you have any reads similar to that?

• The moment you instantly jumped on Cruaader's wagon and started staunchly defending your vote. It's too well correlated that when ND offers his insight and attacks Cruaader's play, you INSTANTLY jumped onto his wagon. Even if you had suspicions about him, as an experienced player, you would exercise less impulsiveness when voting for someone.
• His lurking is what made me first suspect he was scum. Than he jumped on Cruaader's wagon when all we knew at that time was that he was a new player playing his first ever game. While I currently don't disagree with parts of his read, I still think there's a good chance he's town w/ flavor; but that doesn't matter because at the time of his scum read, it was not known that Cruaader had played Mafia games previously elsewhere and it was assumed he was a new player playing his 1st game. At the time, it was a very scummy vote, and his attempts to justify the vote by pointing to Cruaader being a player with some experience - which we only learned about AFTER he voted for Cruaader - don't help me with ruling him out as scum.
• Please note that I used to confidently think he was town. This was because all I knew at the time was that Cruaader was a new player - which I took to mean this was his first ever Mafia game. As a result of this noob status, I attributed anything potentially scummy about his n00b play to just him being a noob. If he were a noob scum, he would have just voted for somebody who wasn't his fellow scum - didn't matter who, he'd create a reason and vote for that person. I'm willing to make scumreads off of it because all we knew about Cruaader when ND made his read was that he was a new player playing his 1st game.
  
  Currently however (the above paragraph was what I used earlier when I read Cruaader as strong town to justify my read on him), I've changed my opinion about Cruaader. I don't think he's a VT, but I think there's still a good chance he's a town w/ flavor.
• Similar to what?

[ChippeRock]

Sorry folks - I’m in England visiting my uncle, flight just landed at Gatwick two hours ago. Dead tired and going to bed right now, but at least phase timings are more convenient now.

##vote Flav as policy. Either he’s scum or, no offense, useless town.

And now he appears, how convenient.

While I agree that the whole thing is very strange and agree there should be suspicion, I don't think we should policy lynch him as this gameplay from him is completely out of the ordinary for him as I explained in this post.

[Balki Bartokomous]

@rdrivera, sheep me on Flavius please.

Could you present me a better reason then "Secretary" told him Balki is experienced and clever"? I don't buy this and Fox voting him make me less inclined to follow on it.

Sure, I think that Secretary argument is whack.

Here are my thoughts on Flavius.

[Durga]

I'm not sure why Moscow plays this game. I'm not keen on letting him get by on his same shit every game

[Balki Bartokomous]

@Durga, if you had to pick Flavius, Bozo, or TrPrado to lynch, where is your head at now?

[Jamiet99uk]

VOTE COUNT 1.8.5:

FlaviusAetius(4) - Balki Bartokomous, Dargorygel, Foxcastle, Moscowfleet
bozotheclown(3) - Percy Williams, et, Damo666
TrPrado(3) - Tom Bombadil, FlaviusAetius, ChippeRock
CruaaderReynauld(2) - ND, Teacon7
ChippeRock(2) - bozotheclown, EspressoPatronum
MoscowFleet(1) - Durga
teacon7(2) - connorcompton, Nephthys
Tom Bombadil(1) - Squigs44  
Percy Williams(1) - xorxes
No‑Lynch(1) - CruaaderReynauld
Durga(1) - Carl Tuckerson
Foxcastle(1) - Rdrivera2005

Unvoted: TrPrado

FLAVIUS.A. is scheduled to be executed. 

A little less than five hours is left in this phase of our gripping bench trial.

[ChippeRock]

I'm not sure why Moscow plays this game. I'm not keen on letting him get by on his same shit every game

Except he's never lurked to this degree ever, as I explained here. Get your parked safe vote off of him, and find somebody who's more likely to be scum. Lynching Moscow is like spinning a roulette wheel - since he's never done this before, there's no indication at all that he could be scum or town in any way.

[Durga]

@Durga, if you had to pick Flavius, Bozo, or TrPrado to lynch, where is your head at now?

I don't feel great about any of those. What's the case on bozo

[Durga]

I'm not sure why Moscow plays this game. I'm not keen on letting him get by on his same shit every game

Except he's never lurked to this degree ever, as I explained here. Get your parked safe vote off of him, and find somebody who's more likely to be scum. Lynching Moscow is like spinning a roulette wheel - since he's never done this before, there's no indication at all that he could be scum or town in any way.

Doesn't matter he shouldn't be playing

[Foxcastle]

I'm not sure why Moscow plays this game. I'm not keen on letting him get by on his same shit every game

Except he's never lurked to this degree ever, as I explained here. Get your parked safe vote off of him, and find somebody who's more likely to be scum. Lynching Moscow is like spinning a roulette wheel - since he's never done this before, there's no indication at all that he could be scum or town in any way.

I'm with Durga. If he's town, MF's lurking doesn't help solve the game and becomes deadweight if scum get in the lead. If he's scum, he can just coast to the end. He should either participate or not be in the game.