Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

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xorxes
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Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

#1021 Post by xorxes » Fri Dec 07, 2018 1:01 am

Balki Bartokomous wrote:
Fri Dec 07, 2018 12:54 am

Well, I just reject the notion that scum are likely to be "maximally spread out."

Especially considering we don't know rdrivera's alignment, so we don't know if scum had a clear incentive to be on the Squigs wagon, I don't think there is any reason for us to assume that scum were spread out in any particular way. There are lots of reasons for scum to choose who to vote for that have nothing to do with, "Um, I have one teammate over there, and one teammate over there, so I've got to be here."
There are other considerations, indeed. But you can't deny that all other things being equal, there is a tendency for scum to avoid being next to each other.

Ezio
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Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

#1022 Post by Ezio » Fri Dec 07, 2018 1:06 am

There is a tendency, but scum also like to avoid being alone on their wagons at EoD. When there are such clear wagons heading into EoD, you most often find scum hopping onto those wagons.

xorxes
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Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

#1023 Post by xorxes » Fri Dec 07, 2018 1:10 am

Ezio wrote:
Fri Dec 07, 2018 1:06 am
There is a tendency, but scum also like to avoid being alone on their wagons at EoD. When there are such clear wagons heading into EoD, you most often find scum hopping onto those wagons.
Vecna and rd were both absent at EOD, I think from before the final wagons formed, so neither could hop.

Balki Bartokomous
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Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

#1024 Post by Balki Bartokomous » Fri Dec 07, 2018 1:12 am

xorxes wrote:
Fri Dec 07, 2018 1:01 am
There are other considerations, indeed. But you can't deny that all other things being equal, there is a tendency for scum to avoid being next to each other.
I don’t know about that. I’ve heard it said. But, I don’t know that it’s true.

On the one hand, the scum teammates generally have the same goals so sometimes they vote the same way. On the other hand, it is possible they believe that voting together will cause people to think they are on the same team?

Except, here on Webdip there is a lazy perception that scum tend to “spread out maximally,” so why wouldn’t they counteract that by voting together?

I don’t know, I don’t buy it. I don’t think the “maximal spread” assumption is reasonable or helpful. I hope you can find more useful applications for color coding.

ghug
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Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

#1025 Post by ghug » Fri Dec 07, 2018 2:56 am

We should remember that scum can talk during the day.

I don't scumread bozo. I think there are at least three people I'd rather lynch, and Ezio's making a convincing case to be number four.

I want everyone to give me their favorite Balki alternative. If you think you can make the alternative wagon happen, you should work to do it. I'll help you make Balki a contender again if the wagon dies.


Balki, what points against you do you think are town-motivated, and which do you think are scum motivated? I'd like succinct bullet points, as I'm a simpleton, and you have a way with words that tends to distract from content.

Balki Bartokomous
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Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

#1026 Post by Balki Bartokomous » Fri Dec 07, 2018 3:41 am

ghug wrote:
Fri Dec 07, 2018 2:56 am
Balki, what points against you do you think are town-motivated, and which do you think are scum motivated? I'd like succinct bullet points, as I'm a simpleton, and you have a way with words that tends to distract from content.
Yeah, I’ll do this exercise tomorrow.

ghug
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Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

#1027 Post by ghug » Fri Dec 07, 2018 4:04 am

Balki Bartokomous wrote:
Fri Dec 07, 2018 3:41 am
ghug wrote:
Fri Dec 07, 2018 2:56 am
Balki, what points against you do you think are town-motivated, and which do you think are scum motivated? I'd like succinct bullet points, as I'm a simpleton, and you have a way with words that tends to distract from content.
Yeah, I’ll do this exercise tomorrow.
To clarify, I'm looking for arguments, not people.

damian
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Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

#1028 Post by damian » Fri Dec 07, 2018 4:41 am

I'm going to try and piece together two cases for a non-Balki lynch.

One on Fox and one on Ezio. As they were are two non-wagon voters D1 who moved to Squig D2. By the end hopefully I'll have an idea of who I prefer.

Ezio:
You asked me why I said you looked bad regardless of how yesterday's EoD flipped. It was because I was scimreading you pretty hard at that point with your defense of RD and I didn't actually do good analysis if squigs flipped town, as evidenced by me needing to do so Mich work today.
This seems pretty scummy to me. Like Ezio was trying to set up Ghug as the mislynch for today, and had to back pedal. In the process couldn't keep his story straight.

Going back to day 2 I'm actually not sure his flip to scum reading ghug even makes a lot of sense. It feels very pre-emptive. Since its based entirely on the presumption that squigs must be scum. Weird AF. But I'm not sure scum would build a big argument around Squig flipping scum. So this might actually be town indicative.

Ezio also basically decided to take the role of the town leader yesterday, and tried really hard to get people to follow him. In sheeping Flum/Vecna. To me the oddest part is that the only reasons Ezio had to to vote for Squig, as far as I can see is. Flum voted for him, Tom accused him, and he would be a high information lynch.

I also really don't like the final post of the day
yea so if squiggs is town:

I'm much more clueless.

My gut then says Xorxes/Flum look MUCH worse, but i see where they're coming from.

Ghug looks bad either way though. He loves defending townies when scum.
I understand that there was a lot of time pressure in that last minute. But given that he spent most of the day pushing xorxes or me to be lynched. I find it hard to imagine he hadn't spent anytime considering the angle of Squig's being town.

Throwing ghug here as bad either way seems like a way to set up the next lynch.

The tonal shift from D2 to D3 also feels weird. Ezio was pushing so hard to lead the town, even pre-100% confidence xorxes nonsense. He's all but dropped that pretense in day 3. Either his ego is beaten from the mistakes of day 2, or he's trying to lay a little bit lower, take off some of the heat?

Also
I'm gonna [[vote bozo. I'll make my case when I'm back from work. It's not gonna be a good one.
If so lvr excited for today to be me vs balki, or bozo vs balki.
What is this? I don't get it. What happened to the promised case on bozo? I think the most we've got so far was. Essentially "I like the vote analysis of them as scum together (me and bozo)" and "Who in this game doesn't scumread Bozo". Trying to size up the appetite for a bozo lynch rather than just making your case isn't a good look.

Fox next

damian
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Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

#1029 Post by damian » Fri Dec 07, 2018 5:14 am

So I really don't get the evolution of Fox's read on Squig. D1 it as a solid scum read. For meta reasons that were of equivalent strength to the ones given Ezio.

But he wanted to vote for Ezio because he was the more interesting flip. Without elaboration as to why.

What about Ezio made him a more interesting flip D1 Foxy? Thinking back were there any connections you expected to be able to analyze based on Ezio's flip?

Then Day 2 he still thinks Squig is scum, but once again chooses not to push him in favour of Ghug/Bozo. Because he's convinced whether Squig was town or scum
ghug would be guilty. Yet ends up sliding to Squig because he is scummiest of the bunch? I didn't see any evolution between Ghug is guilty either way thus I'm voting for him to Squig is the scummiest so I've voting for him. Given the amount of thinking outloud Fox has been doing I'd expect to see some sort of paper trail that explained the switch.

I also maintain everything about his interactions with RDR in D2 was protective and weird. Mischaracterizing my statement about RDR's day 1 play to defend him from phantom accusations. Which still feels scummy to me.

And today was just a wild progression from I'm not going to OMGUS balki to, I'm going to OMGUS balki. With I don't feel much of a stop inbetween. I'm increasingly unconvinced by anyone who says Balki doesn't feel like he's trying to solve anything. Because I think it looks like Balki is trying to solve stuff during his reread posts, and it feels like an argument that hasn't been updated to the realities of day 3.

damian
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Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

#1030 Post by damian » Fri Dec 07, 2018 5:17 am

Of the two I think Ezio looks scummier. Especially with the contrast between D2 and D3. And Ezio's push back yesterday against The RDR wagon, for not following his appointed town leaders.

I'm thinking if Ezio flips scum. The RDR, Fox, Ezio team I mentioned at the beginning of the day would make a lot of sense.

##Vote Ezio

Vecna
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Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

#1031 Post by Vecna » Fri Dec 07, 2018 10:23 am

##vote Balki

Vecna
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Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

#1032 Post by Vecna » Fri Dec 07, 2018 10:26 am

I really dont want to be wrong here, but this just feels right. I also really liked Fox's last two posts, and unless he really read into the Balki sentiment that ive been feeling and portraying in a few posts over the course of this game, that post just feels like it comes from town nearly every single time.

Vecna
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Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

#1033 Post by Vecna » Fri Dec 07, 2018 10:27 am

Also, generally I dont get why people think hedging is scummy. Town is clueless and has doubt. Scum formulate a plan, and need to be convincing to show that theyre right to push through the mislynches.

The doubt in Fox' play makes me lean towards him being town.

Disclaimer; I still suck at reading Fox. Such Hedge

rdrivera2005
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Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

#1034 Post by rdrivera2005 » Fri Dec 07, 2018 12:15 pm

I was doing a re-read, specially on EOD2 that I missed and I just feel scum were just comfortable with the ways things were going. Only 4 votes on the last minute, all of them to consolidate on the two main wagons. I know I have a unique perspective as I am only one that can be sure both days were town x town at EOD and that the VCA is probably a dead end.
This also make me think that trying to analyse something just from the wagons is either a lazy town approach or a scum way to seem to be scum hunting.

Here I have to agree with Balki (and I pointed it to Bozo yesterday too), the argument that scum was spread, or that there is one scum on one wagon and 2 in the other are all pure and complete WIFOM. I have seen games where scum voted together both D1 and D2 and a game where I won the game as scum pushing that Bozo voted together with the other scum. I know this is becoming a bit convoluted but what I want to say is that this kind of argument is lazy and pure WIFOM most of the time. Another thing that are striking me as odd is how many people are trying to catch the whole scum team at once, even with no flip until now.

I still think Damian is scum. He pointed a scumteam of me-Fox-Ezio and then voted Ezio because he defended me yesterday? Why? If you think I am scum you should vote me first, if I flip scum then you push Ezio. Seems a lot like he know I will not flip scum. Or he is bussing a scum mate to get credit later and get me lynched. Either way I don't see a town reason to play this way.

I am starting to get bad vibes from Bozo. I didn´t like the way his analysis of D1 wagons are informing all his play, when we now know for sure both main wagons on D1 are town. His exchange with Vecna also seems really forced, Vecna clearly stated he suspect Balki + Xorxes + Bozo and accused Bozo of bussing.

I am torn on Balki. I didn't like the way he pushed my lynch and the way he twists other arguments to fit his own. On the other side I expect scum to be bussing now and I didn't expect scum Balki to attach to scum Damian the way he is doing, but then we get back to WIFOM. Considering his wagon is far on the lead and that Damian seems to be widely town read, I will ##vote Bozo for now.

bozotheclown
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Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

#1035 Post by bozotheclown » Fri Dec 07, 2018 2:09 pm

Balki Bartokomous wrote:
Thu Dec 06, 2018 11:29 pm
bozotheclown wrote:
Thu Dec 06, 2018 11:19 pm
Balki Bartokomous wrote:
Thu Dec 06, 2018 11:15 pm
@Bozo, can you remind me why you are voting to lynch me?
I think you are the most likely scum of those that did not vote for ND, and I doubt all three scum voted for ND.
Doesn't really answer the question. Also, what? That is crazy bizarre.

So...the ND wagon lynched a townie, right? So, are you saying that people off of that wagon are particularly likely to be scum? Why?

I agree that probably not all scum voted for ND, but that's just based on general math.

Why do you consider me to be scummy other than the fact that I did not vote to lynch Town!ND?
I do not know how this does not answer the question. Obviously I am voting to lynch you because I think you are scum, and I told you the reason why I think that. It is not that complex, but I will restate it:
1. I doubt all three scum moved to the ND wagon at EOD.
2. You, Foxcastle, and Ezio are the only remaining possibilities for a scum that did not vote for ND.
3. I think Foxcastle is town.
4. I was assuming Ezio is town, although I am not as sure now.
5. By POE, you are likely scum.

To answer your other question, yes, I think there are other reasons to suspect you as scum. I like some of the points made Vecna, xorxes, and Foxcastle. Some examples of things I find suspicious are your town read of damian for his color test results and your push on Foxcastle.

bozotheclown
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Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

#1036 Post by bozotheclown » Fri Dec 07, 2018 2:25 pm

xorxes wrote:
Fri Dec 07, 2018 12:16 am
I finally figured out how to do colors:

Day1:

ND (6) Flum Vecna xorxes Squigs damian rd
Squigs (4) ghug Tom bozo ND
Ezio (2) Fox Balki
damian (1) Ezio

Assuming scum maximally spread themselves out, and assuming town!Ezio for now, scum team here is: {Vecna|damian|rd}+bozo+{Fox|Balki}

Day2:

Squigs (5) Flum bozo Fox Ezio xorxes
rd (4) Balki ghug Squigs damian
Balki (1) Vecna
damian (1) rd

And from here with the same assumptions: {bozo|Fox}+{Balki|damian}+{Vecna|rd}

Combining both I get: bozo+Balki+{Vecna|rd]
Your assumption is not correct.

The D1 Squigs wagon was all town, and it is possible the D2 Squigs wagon was all town. Why? I don't know, but with town pushing Squigs, the scum probably had no reason to join in.

damian
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Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

#1037 Post by damian » Fri Dec 07, 2018 3:14 pm

rdrivera2005 wrote:
Fri Dec 07, 2018 12:15 pm
I still think Damian is scum. He pointed a scumteam of me-Fox-Ezio and then voted Ezio because he defended me yesterday? Why? If you think I am scum you should vote me first, if I flip scum then you push Ezio. Seems a lot like he know I will not flip scum. Or he is bussing a scum mate to get credit later and get me lynched. Either way I don't see a town reason to play this way.
What? I posted a whole long thing about what I found suspicious about Ezio, and you chose to hone in on a single comment about him. Casting that as the entire reason I'm voting for him.

In order of confidence in their scumminess my reads are Ezio, Fox, Rdr, Bozo/Balki. Ezio's scumminess doesn't hinge on you being scum. Your characterization of me doing this to get you lynched later is especially weird.

You've expressed a level of paranoia this game that I've been finding very suspicious. This latest post just continues that trend.

damian
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Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

#1038 Post by damian » Fri Dec 07, 2018 3:20 pm

bozotheclown wrote:
Fri Dec 07, 2018 2:25 pm

Your assumption is not correct.

The D1 Squigs wagon was all town, and it is possible the D2 Squigs wagon was all town. Why? I don't know, but with town pushing Squigs, the scum probably had no reason to join in.
I find this supposition about D2 to be odd. For it to be true. RDR would have to be town. Which would leave you with precisely three people would could be scum candidates.

Myself, Vecna and Balki.

I find the supposition especially curious because we still don't know a significant chunk of the Squig wagon on D2's alignments.

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Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

#1039 Post by bozotheclown » Fri Dec 07, 2018 3:27 pm

Balki Bartokomous wrote:
Fri Dec 07, 2018 12:12 am
I mean, can Bozo and Foxy really be this dense as Town?

Yesterday they mislynched Squigs:
worcej wrote:
Wed Dec 05, 2018 10:56 pm
Vote Count:
Squigs44 (5) Fluminator bozotheclown Foxcastle Ezio xorxes
rdrivera2005 (4) Balki Bartokomous ghug Squigs44 damian
Balki Bartokomous (1) Vecna
damian (1) rdrivera2005

Currently Squigs44 is set to be lynched.

You have ~3 minutes.
So today they are both voting to lynch Balki, who was not on that wagon, and who was actively defending Squigs?

Why in the Hell are they trying to lynch me right now if they are town? Why aren't they recalibrating after lynching a smart, productive townie yesterday?

Are there townies out there who see what is going on?
I do not give you any town credit for defending Squigs, as scum you would know he was going to flip town. I find trying to town read yourself for defending Squigs suspicious.

Foxcastle
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Re: Mafia Invitational - Welcome to Wakanda

#1040 Post by Foxcastle » Fri Dec 07, 2018 3:28 pm

The Great* Balki Reread

*To avoid confusion, the adjective "great" is applied to Reread and not to Balki. Alternate title, "The Great Reread of Balki"

Day 1

P1. Suggests (jokingly, I presume) sheeping ghug. Scumreads Damian's second post and votes him for it with not additional clarification.

P2. Cheers on Xorxes for following him onto Damian. "I love having my own little disciple to follow me around and observe my teachings. @xorx, you definitely chose the right spiritual leader." Trying to pocket Xorxes or something? That's a stretch, but this is the kind of thing that makes me leery.

Asks why I am assuming scum have no kill and "finds it interesting" (read: suspicious, as he later clarifies) that I'm talking about game balance. I wasn't assuming scum have no kill, I was asking because I have never played a closed setup before. Also, just a few hours before, he himself said "I don't think we should assume that mafia get a factional kill at all. Though, I bet they have ways to kill us if we get too rowdy." Which is more likely: that Balki is scatterbrained and his assumption on whether there's a scum kill changed naturally, or that Balki is scum, and he knows there's a scum kill and forgot that he had already talked about whether to assume that when he dinged me for assuming scum had no kill?

P6. Filler post replying to Flum's "No I'm not [scum]". 66 words of sarcasm resulting in "I'm putting Fluminator solidly among my town reads." Now that I'm tunneling Balki, I wonder if he crafted it to make it look like he was seriously town reading Flum. It's not, it's blather, but maybe he's hoping that someone just skimming will just see the last sentence and not realize that it's sarcasm.

P7. Filler post replying to Damian, who asked if there was a point to Balki's filler post replying to Flum.

P8. Self congratulatory post comparing himself to a folk figure who is only capable of leading rats and stealing children.

P10. Notes that he'll be absent because of IRL things. Doesn't have any strong feelings about anyone's alignment, but Damian and myself "give [him] the slight heebeegeebees, but it's pretty minor." Votes for me, and in response to Squigs question about why, says that it's not specific, and looks to him like "effort to blend" and is a weak read.

P11. This is where Balki actually shows up for real for the first time. Backs off the Damian wagon that he started, asking for someone to give him a case on Damian. Suggests that people should vote for who you think is likely to flip scum, and that pressure votes make it hard to "see where we really are" and are ineffective if you call them that anyway.

It seems to me like he had already decided to back off the Damian wagon by P10 (6+ hours earlier) when he voted me over Damian. We both gave him the heebeegeebees, but Damian had written "clearly the scummiest thing I have read in like a week," but his scumread of both of us was "very minor." At this point (16:58) Damian was at 4, and Balki moved off him to me, putting Damian at 3. But then he comes in 6 hours later (10:01) when the Damian wagon is down to 2 (Xorxes and Ezio, Vecna had moved to rdrivera) and ask people to justify the wagon again, like he's all concerned he started a fad that now he's not sure about? He already wasn't sure about it, and it was already fading. I'm not just shading Balki, I'm actually wondering what the explanation is, because it looks like an attempt to get the Damian wagon back up and running again without being seen as leading it.

"And are we threatening to kill squigs for being too aggressive? For being just “different than last time”?" Balki knows that meta reads are large part of this game, and that people acting differently is a valid question to pursue. The scum-Balki explanation here would be that he knew Squigs was town and would possibly be lynched (squigs was leading at 3 votes) and thought it would look good to have been defending a misunderstood townie. The town-Balki explanation rests on him not buying into meta-reads as a thing, which is possibly true, I don't think Balki strongly relies on meta reads.

Possibly the first real engagement on substantive issues with someone else is with Vecna, where he disagrees with Vecna's scumread of Rdrivera for scumreading the top two wagons (Squigs, Damian) but then voting Ezio. Then scumreads Vecna for how he phrased a sentence.

Some back and forth with ND on whether being on a work trip is an excuse. Asks for more information on ND's scumread of Ezio and Squigs (votes Squigs).

P12. Linguistic analysis of Ezio for using the word "threat" and concluding that Ezio's Day 1 proposal is "performance art". I don't go in for the linguistic analysis, but the Ezio thing was real enough, even if it wasn't particularly original.

P19. 15 minutes out. Votes Damian with no explanation, breaking a tie for second place, with Squigs 4 versus Damain 3. Then immediately (1 minute later) votes Ezio. So the initial question is why vote Damian? He had been backing off that scum read, he didn't justify it, it's not clear that he ever got a case he asked for on Damian. But he had just most recently scumread Ezio, which is where he jumps to next. Only after he votes does he point out that he isn't caught up and asks if there's anything he needs to know. Why not ask that question first?

It looks to me that the end of Day 1, Balki couldn't even follow his own advice to vote for who you think is most scummy, and was simply looking at wagons trying to decide who push as an alternative to squigs. Which is a decision town often has to make, but the vote for Damian (a read he was already backed off of) and then the jump to Ezio (his most recent and pretty strong scumread) makes me think that there are other calculations Balki had to make.

EOD1 Balki is voting Ezio with his scumread, the one and only Foxcastle.

Day 2

P30. "Balki is here!" I can't keep up this depth of analysis and commentary since Balki picked up the pace on Day 2. This is where I seriously start considering whether Balki is seriously scumhunting, though. [Edited to add, actually, the Day 2 analysis is not deep because Balki does very little worth commenting on...]

Proposes mass reveal of roles and powers. This seems dumb, given that early on Balki was pointing out that we knew so little about the game that speculating on game balance or whether there was a night kill wasn't useful. Others have already poked holes in why scum could easily game this. What I find interesting though is "while scum can lie about their powers, they don’t know all of the powers the town has, and their fake claims may be testable." I wonder if the mafia chat came up with a scheme whereby they could manufacture enough "proven" mislynches if they could convince town to mass reveal. It's a long shot, and they'd have to know it had almost no chance of happening, but maybe it was worth the try.

P32-41. Balki's day 2 is useless. Was the tufted leather armchair not comfy enough? Was the oolong tea just too much? He makes small comments, asks small questions, pushes back on a couple things, tries to lynch Rdrivera despite basically never having commented on Rdrivera before, but basing a vote on one "scummity scumbucket" post, forgets his prior reads. Which, actually, there aren't that many of.

There are two posts here that demonstrate some actual thinking and are more than just a thin comment or one line question. On page 35 he replies to Damian's question about Balki's scum meta with a presentation of how each side could come out, enough to conclude that Damian's question is NAI; and a takedown of Ezio's scumread of him.

Balki makes 1 vote on Day 2, the first vote on Rdrivera. I don't see any actual scumhunting. He presents no case, he pursues no leads, he proposes no theories.

Day 3

I guess now we're getting into the meat of it? Is this where scumhunting happens? I was promised that on Day 2, and disappointed, but we're finally starting a reread.

P43. Townreads Xorxes for guessing on Day 1 that the the scum kill would process with the lynch. " I think this was a reasonable guess, and it is what I was thinking would probably happen too." Actually, Balki, you were thinking that we couldn't assume things about the scumkill. I'm curious which of the two following things you actually thought, and why on Day 3 you're retconning yourself to agree with Xorxes?
Balki Bartokomous wrote:
Sat Dec 01, 2018 11:32 pm
Squigs44 wrote:
Sat Dec 01, 2018 11:29 pm
The no night thing is the most interesting thing to me. How does this work without NKs? Mafia day kills?
Assuming that our fearless GM would tell us rules if she wants us to know rules. I don't think we should assume that mafia get a factional kill at all. Though, I bet they have ways to kill us if we get too rowdy.
Balki Bartokomous wrote:
Wed Dec 05, 2018 11:47 pm
xorxes wrote:
Sat Dec 01, 2018 11:32 pm
Maybe they vote during the day and the NK processes together with the lynch?
So, just started my reread. I have to point this out. There was confusion on the first page about how the game would work with no night phase. Xorxes was the first to speculate that the NK would process together with the lynch.

I think this was a reasonable guess, and it is what I was thinking would probably happen too. But I think it's significant that Xorxes was the first to put that guess in thread, and it seems like this is exactly correct. I would think that scum knew exactly how these mechanics worked form the start, and they would be hesitant to reveal the correct mechanics, for fear it would give them away.

I betcha Xorxes is town.
Yeah, Day 3 is where Balki changes his strategy from "many words, little content" to "much content, little scumhunting".

P44. Things Balki loves: mass reveals and the choose-a-color scum-detector. Does Balki always go after the psych angle? Thing like the linguistic analysis, the idea that the color test is actually indicative, because that's pretty thin stuff.

Oh look actual analysis on rdrivera's response to the EOD2 flip. Which is legit, but also, why comment "Suspicious!" like you didn't already think rdrivera was suspicious? You were voting for him, after all...

Still "very dedicated to lynching Foxcastle or rdrivera this phase." Still has presented basically no case on me, and relying on 2 posts from rdrivera for that decision.

P45. Okay, actually adding on to the rdrivera case.

P47. Getting into with Vecna. Vecna has been low-key watching Balki all game, and now, finally, two of Balki's biggest posts are to respond to the scumread.

P48. Some questions, but also plenty of useless talking. I already responded to the "Foxy is afraid of me" post. But this is the kind of thing that worries me about Balki: he just asserts that the scumteam is me, Rdrivera, and one of Bozo/Ezio without really presenting that case on why. Town Balki does better than that.

P50. I think I replied to these posts about me, but generally he spends time asking other people to convince themselves that they think I'm scum rather than putting a real case up.

I'm gonna stop here, because that's mostly caught up, and I want to engage with some of P51-52 directly. This is what I mean when I say this is Balki's scum meta: Balki claims to see the structure of the game and have divined the truth, but then it turns out that most of the decisions he reaches come with little or no justification, and are not actually based on gamewide explanation but rather are cobbled together from reactions to specific posts. And I think they are decisions, not conclusions, because as scum, he doesn't need to conclude anything.

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