webdiplomacy.net

Just to be safe, I'll post both...

Signups
Signups

1. Durga
2. worcej
3. xorxes
4. RagingIke297
5. rdrivera2005
6. thdfrance
7. damo666
8. ND
9. ghug
10. yavuzovic
11. Tom Bombadil
12. Squigs44
13. DemonRHK
14.
15.
16.
17.
18.
19.
20.
21.

Substitutes

A. Nephthys
B.
C.

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1. Durga
2. worcej
3. xorxes
4. RagingIke297
5. rdrivera2005
6. thdfrance
7. damo666
8. ND
9. ghug
10. yavuzovic
11. ChippeRock
12. Tom Bombadil
13. Squigs44
14. DemonRHK
15.
16.
17.
18.
19.
20.
21.

Substitutes

A. Nephthys
B.
C.

Signups

1. Durga
2. worcej
3. xorxes
4. RagingIke297
5. rdrivera2005
6. thdfrance
7. damo666
8. ND
9. ghug
10. yavuzovic
11. ChippeRock
12. Tom Bombadil
13. Squigs44
14. DemonRHK
15. bozo
16.
17.
18.
19.
20.
21.

Substitutes

A. Nephthys
B.
C.

1. Durga
2. worcej
3. xorxes
4. RagingIke297
5. rdrivera2005
6. thdfrance
7. damo666
8. ND
9. ghug
10. yavuzovic
11. ChippeRock
12. Tom Bombadil
13. Squigs44
14. DemonRHK
15. bozo
16. Vecna
17.
18.
19.
20.
21.

Substitutes

A. Nephthys
B.
C.

Doesnt this setup need a mechanism to stop scum from just peeking into the box and then distributing all the items amongst themselves?

Even with 3 scum alive you can just keep it in the team forever. Seems like as soon as scum get the box, town just loses out on an incredible amount of power. Very swingy?

Adding a delayed announcement of who gave the box to who could be interesting.

N1: Brainbomb gives the box to RHK
N2: RHK gives the box to Vecna
D3: Announcement that Brain gave the box to RHK on N1
N3: Vecna gives the box to ND
D4: Announcement that RHK gave the box to Vecna on N2

etc.

I would want you yo add Chippe without a problem and give another chance to him, or at least add him as a substitute and if we can't complete 21 players, you can keep him for that too.
He is right, he got a punishment that prohibits him to access God QT. It's Foxcastle's game but my opinion is letting him play with us.

1. Durga
2. worcej
3. xorxes
4. RagingIke297
5. rdrivera2005
6. thdfrance
7. damo666
8. ND
9. ghug
10. yavuzovic
11.
12. Tom Bombadil
13. Squigs44
14. DemonRHK
15. bozo
16. Vecna
17. bo
18.
19.
20.
21.

Substitutes

A. Nephthys
B.

The GMs made a decision, so that’s the “official ruling” you’re looking for.

Thanks, Bo.

ChippeRock, please respect this decision. My concern is not just whether you get access to the god QT, it's also that, if you roll scum, you could unfairly out your teammates after being lynched (for example, if you're upset that they bused you), or that if you roll a PR and are night killed, that you might deadpost information you had that you didn't get to share before you died. And this is only my view, but from your deadpost in the cultafia game, it looks to me like you might have spoiled the game if you'd had the information to do so. That's too high a risk for me if I want this game to be successful and fun for everyone. The best thing you can do is accept these consequences for now, and demonstrate that you can follow the rules in the future.

Vecna wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 17, 2018 8:05 am

Doesnt this setup need a mechanism to stop scum from just peeking into the box and then distributing all the items amongst themselves?

Even with 3 scum alive you can just keep it in the team forever. Seems like as soon as scum get the box, town just loses out on an incredible amount of power. Very swingy?

The oracle announcements are intended to be the mechanism to make scum think twice about hoarding the box. The count option only reveals how many items are left, not what they are, so scum will have to worry that handing the box around to themselves could possibly out two of them. My thinking here is based on M35 (the nametag game), where scum were super cautious about not looking at their nametag because one of the tags in game was an oracle reveal.

I'm also planning on nerfing the count option. The intention had been to create another aspect of the game where, if the countdown before the box exploded was known, town and scum would be competing to make sure it ended up in the hands of the other team. But if the box survives to the endgame, its ability to block the NK becomes way too powerful for town. My first assumption was that greedy townies would pretty much always open the box (looking for a gun, probably), but I think that an overly cautious town could resist the temptation because they know how powerful it would be in the endgame.

I could replace the count option with a one-time option to reveal the order of everyone who has held the box...

1. Durga
2. worcej
3. xorxes
4. RagingIke297
5. rdrivera2005
6. thdfrance
7. damo666
8. ND
9. ghug
10. yavuzovic
11. peterlund
12. Tom Bombadil
13. Squigs44
14. DemonRHK
15. bozo
16. Vecna
17. bo
18.
19.
20.
21.

Substitutes

A. Nephthys
B.

Oh yeah, fresh off the joy of victory in the last game, I'm well up for this. I have great faith in Foxcastle to deliver a great experience.

1. Durga
2. worcej
3. xorxes
4. RagingIke297
5. rdrivera2005
6. thdfrance
7. damo666
8. ND
9. ghug
10. yavuzovic
11. peterlund
12. Tom Bombadil
13. Squigs44
14. DemonRHK
15. bozo
16. Vecna
17. bo
18. Jamiet99uk
19.
20.
21.

Substitutes

A. Nephthys
B.

ChippeRock wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 17, 2018 3:02 am

So who banned me from Mafia? Some powerless unofficial vigilante individuals?

Cmon, the GM is the secretary, he enforces all the decisions the ruling body made and the ruling body is the president, he makes all of the decisions.

That's BS. Plenty of people have deadposted far worse than me (*cough* *cough*), and that's the worst I can do this game, and this vigilante GM is unofficially banning me from a game that I am allowed to play?

Bullshit. Whoever ruled on my Mafia ban is the ruling body. Ruling body, make the decision.

ChippeRock wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 17, 2018 3:25 am

So who was the ruling body who banned me than? As I recall it only a few individuals had any input on that decision. Not everyone related to Mafia.

This sure doesn't sound like a democracy.

How can you have a ruling body when it serves your needs but not have one when it serves your needs? This is two faced and you're not giving everyone fair treatment.

I didn't read Darg's PM before I posted. And I only posted 1 post after the phase ended which said (in response to "you suck at this game") "You're only now just realizing that?".

Sounds like Fox has a real legitimate reason when that's a harmless deadpost and let alone I have no access to God QT.

Bull. Shit. That's just ridiculous.

Chippe,

Yes, other people have broken the rules, most punish themselves or are punished and sit out. However, those who are not punished are people that 1. Haven't caused a game to be prematurely ended 2. Aren't breaking rules in their first games and 3. Have played/gm'ed long enough to become respected members of the mafia community.

Right now there is no "ruling body", the GM is the judge, jury and executioner of the law, so get any idea of a council that's going to swoop in and allow you to play out of your head, its not going to happen.

After M38, you were banned by me, the GM of the game you wrecked. I sought out advice from highly reputable players who have been around for a very long time, ghug and Bo, as well as from my co-gm, WarLegend. They argued that I should have issued a 2 or 3 game ban and I did not based on the fact that it was your first game and first offence and I wanted to give you a second chance. I am extremely disappointed that in the very next game you played you broke the rules once again. Actually I'm beyond extremely disappointed, I stood up for you and you have not only made yourself look foolish but me as well. If you want us four to reconvene to discuss if you should be allowed to play, we will, my vote will be no and the answer will most likely be a unanimous no.

If you would like "democracy" and have everyone from M38 vote on if you should be able to play in this game, I'm sure everyone would and given what happened that game and the breaking of the rules in the cult game you're going to get a resounding no.

You needed to come out of M38 and have a spotless record for a few games to get people to trust you and stick up for you. Players and GM's want to play the game and have it run smoothly, not have it get bogged down in rules and bans. It appears that Fox believes that excluding you is the best way to accomplish a smooth game.

You had your second chance, you broke the rules again, the GM of this game doesn't want to have the possibility of the rules being broken again or another game ruined and has chosen to exclude you. I don't blame him one bit and I don't feel sorry for you.

-Ike

Thanks everybody who signed up so far! Since signups happened a little faster than I expected, we could possibly start Monday to get things going sooner. If that doesn't work for anyone's schedule, we'll keep the original Wednesday start day.

Some additional notes...

The COUNT option for the Box has been removed and replaced with a LIST option. Once or twice per game (as randomly determined), the player with the box may request the LIST of everyone who has previously possessed the Box. If the LIST options have all been used by previous Box holders, the player receives the next item.

The 'combo Watcher-Tracker' listed in the roles will be called the Observer, and has the following description: “You are the OBSERVER. Each day you must vote for a suspect. Each night, you may investigate a player by PM’ing the GM with the order ##OBSERVE [player]. Your target will not be aware of your visit. At the end of the night, you will receive a report telling you who visited that player and who that player visited. You may not visit the same player on consecutive nights. You win when all of the Mafia have been eliminated, or nothing can stop this from happening.” If there are concerns about this being overpowered, I'll consider reducing it to plain watcher.

The Cop Scan item has been upgraded to give the Mafia a Role Scan so that the item has a purpose for both teams. If you use this item as Town, it returns the target's alignment. If you use this item as Mafia, it returns the target's role.

The US will experience the trauma of the end of Daylight Saving Time (DST) on Sunday, November 4 at 2:00 AM local time, so if there is an end of phase on the afternoon/evening of Nov 4, expect disruption. There will be a Policy, erring on the side of delaying deadlines for some rather than potentially moving deadlines up and causing others to miss deadlines. The GMs will be aggressive about letting players know about changes (up to and including use bolded all-caps). If this has been dealt with before, or if people have strong opinions on how to handle it, feel free to discuss here. Death To Standard Time.

Thank you, Ike, and everyone else who weighed in. I think Ike’s should be the last word on this.

Foxcastle wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 17, 2018 12:33 pm

Thanks, Bo.

ChippeRock, please respect this decision. My concern is not just whether you get access to the god QT, it's also that, if you roll scum, you could unfairly out your teammates after being lynched (for example, if you're upset that they bused you), or that if you roll a PR and are night killed, that you might deadpost information you had that you didn't get to share before you died. And this is only my view, but from your deadpost in the cultafia game, it looks to me like you might have spoiled the game if you'd had the information to do so. That's too high a risk for me if I want this game to be successful and fun for everyone. The best thing you can do is accept these consequences for now, and demonstrate that you can follow the rules in the future.

Given the severity of what took place I agree. I think there will be a time- and a different circumstance where chippee may return. I do not feel that time is yet.

No-one has yet mentioned at what time during the day deadlines will fall. Is it anywhere close to where it normally is.

Regarding Chip. If he joins, I leave. He clearly is not mature enough for this game not even now realizing how bad his behaviour was destroying our games.

peterlund wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 18, 2018 10:36 am

No-one has yet mentioned at what time during the day deadlines will fall. Is it anywhere close to where it normally is.

Regarding Chip. If he joins, I leave. He clearly is not mature enough for this game not even now realizing how bad his behaviour was destroying our games.

Normal deadline 5pm CDT or 6pm EST
Which is like 11 Sandwich Munch Time in the Europe place.

Lets not get into this militant sign up drama where you threaten not to play if certain players sign up. Controversy is a common part of any mafia community. Chippee will get to play again at a later point. And its bad for the community to start threatening gms based on who signs up.

In general you never want to have to refuse a player as a gm. I would wish chippee would recuse himself responsibly and not force gm teams to decide if hes been punished enough. The fact he keeps signing up or pressing the issue is a sign hes not remorseful and that might be because we are being a bit militant towards him in how we administer a punishment.

As such I think reasonable punishments on most sites last 6 months.

Id say we lift his ban as of 2019.
Let him finish out the year thats only 2-3 more games including ours.

If a different gm team wants to lift the ban thats their call. And we shouldnt handcuff gms by openly holding sign ups in contempt.

Sign ups are a fragile contract. Held together by memes and hype. Drama just puts everyone on edge.

Chippee if you wanna play mafia try playing on mafiauniverse or mafiascum. Id be happy to link you to some signups. Im in games on other forums pretty regularly.

brainbomb wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 18, 2018 11:48 am

peterlund wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 18, 2018 10:36 am

No-one has yet mentioned at what time during the day deadlines will fall. Is it anywhere close to where it normally is.

Normal deadline 5pm CDT or 6pm EST
Which is like 11 Sandwich Munch Time in the Europe place.

Yep, deadlines will be the normal times, probably 5PM East Coast/4PM Central/10PM UK/11PM Europe Place.

There will be a week (starting Sunday, Oct 28) where Europe will have ended summer time before the US does (on Sunday, Nov 4). It's giving me a headache trying to figure out what that will look like without springing early deadlines on some players.