Italy and Greece

Use this forum to discuss Diplomacy strategy.
Forum rules
This forum is limited to topics relating to the game Diplomacy only. Other posts or topics will be relocated to the correct forum category or deleted. Please be respectful and follow our normal site rules at http://www.webdiplomacy.net/rules.php.
Post Reply
Message
Author
Carpysmind
Posts: 17
Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2018 10:44 pm
Karma: 8

Italy and Greece

#1 Post by Carpysmind » Mon Aug 27, 2018 5:04 pm

If given the opportunity to take Greece in Fall of 1901, is ITY statisticly or strategically better off putting the fleet in Ion there or convoying his army?
2

mhsmith0
Posts: 159
Joined: Wed Jan 03, 2018 12:35 am
Karma: 53

Re: Italy and Greece

#2 Post by mhsmith0 » Mon Aug 27, 2018 5:45 pm

Carpysmind wrote:
Mon Aug 27, 2018 5:04 pm
If given the opportunity to take Greece in Fall of 1901, is ITY statisticly or strategically better off putting the fleet in Ion there or convoying his army?
That would probably depend on who he's friendly with. Fleet is anti-Turkey, army is anti-Austria. My guess is there isn't a fundamental answer, though it's probably easier in the long run to win with an IA alliance than an IT one, mainly because you have to work hard to manage units and builds in IT to avoid problems, whereas IA can work together well for a pretty long time, especially if Italy is fleet heavy (Italy takes most of Turkey and turns west; Austria builds armies and turns North)

Claesar
Site Moderator
Site Moderator
Posts: 849
Joined: Tue Oct 03, 2017 10:34 am
Karma: 343

Re: Italy and Greece

#3 Post by Claesar » Tue Aug 28, 2018 5:39 am

It also depends on whether you need to guard it in Spring 1902 against a supported attack. If so, the army must be convoyed.
Then again, if you need to guard it with two units, you probably shouldn't have gone there in the first place.
1

eturnage
Posts: 57
Joined: Sun Dec 31, 2017 12:31 pm
Karma: 26

Re: Italy and Greece

#4 Post by eturnage » Tue Aug 28, 2018 9:12 am

Carpysmind wrote:
Mon Aug 27, 2018 5:04 pm
If given the opportunity to take Greece in Fall of 1901, is ITY statisticly or strategically better off putting the fleet in Ion there or convoying his army?
The army. You can use it more effectively to attack Serbia and Trieste. Your fleet remains deployed in Ionian where it is a more dangerous unit. If you want an alliance against Turkey with Austria, you use the two 1901 fleets to enter Aegean Sea with support, or maybe both Aeg and EME, and convoy A Greece to Smyrna. Or as noted first, you can stab Austria. Once you're in Serbia he's in big trouble particularly if you have a Russian ally. F Gre cannot move to Serbia.

ziran
Posts: 156
Joined: Sun Dec 31, 2017 3:21 am
Karma: 53
Contact:

Re: Italy and Greece

#5 Post by ziran » Tue Aug 28, 2018 3:45 pm

eturnage wrote:
Tue Aug 28, 2018 9:12 am
The army. ... If you want an alliance against Turkey with Austria, you use the two 1901 fleets to enter Aegean Sea with support, or maybe both Aeg and EME, and convoy A Greece to Smyrna.
you can't do this with an army in greece? italy has fleets in ION and Nap, austria has one in Alb or Tri. you can't make a supported attack on Aeg, and you can't move to Aeg and and EMS just one or the other.

it's also worth noting that austria can choose which unit they support in. if i'm austria there is no way i support the army in.

eturnage
Posts: 57
Joined: Sun Dec 31, 2017 12:31 pm
Karma: 26

Re: Italy and Greece

#6 Post by eturnage » Tue Aug 28, 2018 8:16 pm

you can't do this with an army in greece? italy has fleets in ION and Nap, austria has one in Alb or Tri. you can't make a supported attack on Aeg, and you can't move to Aeg and and EMS just one or the other.

it's also worth noting that austria can choose which unit they support in. if i'm austria there is no way i support the army in.
The question was posed which is better for Italy. I don't disagree that a paranoid Austria might prefer the fleet. But the OP may be very persuasive and has Austria's blessing for either unit. In which case, as far as Italy's preference it would be the army.

The fleets will need to do some juggling to get into position for the supported attack on Aegean. Will take at least two moves as you astutely point out.

Enriador
Posts: 84
Joined: Sat Sep 30, 2017 1:15 am
Karma: 33
Contact:

Re: Italy and Greece

#7 Post by Enriador » Fri Sep 07, 2018 12:23 am

As Italy, even though I recognize the relevance of A GRE in anti-Austrian intentions, I cannot possibly discard the option of F GRE for two reasons:

1) Greece is one of the most important areas of the map and a fleet there fully unleashes its capabilities, deciding Austrian/Russian/Turkish naval ambitions pretty much on its own.

2) No other combination of neighbors have such strong antagonism as Italy & Turkey. While e.g. A/T can do the army/fleet-only trick, G/R DMZ SWE, PRU, SIL and BAL, or R/E make an arrangement over Scandinavia until they can move on against Germany, Italy & Turkey have very few options to reduce their absurd border tension. An awesome early game alliance that nonetheless must be used with extreme caution - and hence why, for Italy, F GRE is a better bet and safety fallback in case Turkey strikes.

The idea of Italy putting a fleet in Greece has been explored in some depth here: http://uk.diplom.org/pouch//Zine/S2018M ... ening.html (shameless self-promotion disclaimer).

Carpysmind
Posts: 17
Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2018 10:44 pm
Karma: 8

Re: Italy and Greece

#8 Post by Carpysmind » Fri Sep 07, 2018 3:57 am

Thanks everyone who has posted a response. I definitely learned something by asking.

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest