Analysis of game please

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aha195
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Analysis of game please

#1 Post by aha195 » Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:45 pm

Hi Forum,

Was wanting to get some feedback on a live gunboat game.
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=243250

*note: not just on me but the board as a whole*

Specifically what ever the major faults of the players. Thanks in advance.

mhsmith0
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Re: Analysis of game please

#2 Post by mhsmith0 » Sat Jun 29, 2019 12:37 am

Sure why not. Commentary "live" by looking at individual turns and not considering later moves

Spring 1901
6 of the players make standard openings. England... not so much (though the difference between EDI and YOR in this context isn't super important)

Fall 1901
France gets a bit greedy moving to Spain for the +1 at the potential cost of Germany in Burgundy (and it's HARD to expel him, especially wtih England being hostile)
Turkey chooses to attack Russia despite a fairly obvious Italy/Austria developing alliance on the board; Russia chooses to take Rumania with a fleet (anti Turkey pro Austria) despite an IA on the board
Probably not a coincidence that T/R/F all were eliminated by endgame

Spring 1902
Turkey continues to attack Russia for no particularly obvious reason. Russia is fighting England in the north which is probably fine given that Germany let him into Sweden. Turkey loses the coin flip in AEG vs EMED but that's always a risk when IA go Lepanto
Germany goes for Belgium instead of a potential killing blow in Marseilles (Kiel-Ruhr supported by Holland, plus Bur-Mar to bounce, puts France in a tougher spot
England is fighting France, but gambles away LVP in order to focus on the weaker Russian in the less critical theater (Scandinavia instead of the west)
France retreating to Ruhr is interesting. PROBABLY a blunder given all the German bodies in the area and the very obvious lack of upcoming support from England

Autumn 1902
France building A Paris is a bit odd. He seems to be choosing to actively fight BOTH England and Germany, despite having lost Belgium and suffering an English navy in MAO. This seems unlikely to end well depsite the short term advantage of grabbing LVP.
Germany building a navy is probably the correct move here but he's also setting up to fight England and France.
Italy seems to be playing quite well down south, and Austria got into Galicia, while Russia is stuck with a navy in Rumania giving him very few options against Austrian aggression. Italy seems to be set on destroying Turkey, but is not dedicated to Austrian success, as AEG-Con gives Austria a build. Possibly that alliance is soon to fray apart?
Russia doing well on unit count, and English weakness helps too, but the board looks like Austria should roll him up sooner or later. Gal-Ukr and a supported attack on Rumania (if Russia chooses not to use BLA to support hold, and/or Turkey cuts support) would be a devastating blow.

Spring 1903
France making odd moves up north. ENG-LON + LVP-CLY ensures that at worst he's even on English centers this turn (I presume Spain is lost in the fall at this point). He's essentially in a stalemate position against Germany, with three armies unable to really change the status quo, and wasted his navy's move by making a doomed attempt at Belgium which is lost.
England cuts his losses up north. Convoying to Yorkshire is correct and allows him to attack LVP and bounce London, and +1 in spain should counter -1 in norway.
Germany looks ready to overrun the north, and the G-R "alliance" (or at least mutual toleration) seems poised to do well... except Austria is pushing Russia down south.
Italy got a bit greedy i think; ION-EMED supported by AEG basically dooms Turkey, but he tried the convoy instead
Turkey seems to want to fight Russia AND Italy, while Austria is gunning for him. This seems difficult to pull off...

Fall 1903
Italy is probably just over-cautious about losing ION to Austria at this point
Austria swaps Bulgaria for Rumania which seems reasonable enough; Turkey seems doomed, and Russia's units are in poor position to do much. G/I/A could run away with the game if they wanted at this point I think.
England swapping F NTH for A EDI build seems reasonable here. France seems doomed so destroying F Cly isn't crazy, but there's no way he'll recover for an English attack

Spring 1904
I don't really understand why England went to MAO instead of Marseilles here, though I guess he retains the option to grab LVP and he should be +1 unless Germany goes after him (and there's really no rush there)
Italy finally gets the desired convoy to Syria and Turkey is surely doomed
Russia seems unsure of what he wants to do. I TEND to think that being aggressive with something like F Rum-BLA supported by Sev (or perhaps F Rum-BLA AND F Sev-Arm at least gives Russia potential control over how Turkey gets carved up)
Germany seems the strongest power here, as he should be able to roll up France, and England provides little opposition up north. Not sure how England recovered here.
I don't really understand Austria's moveset possible signaling of where he wants his units to go? I kinda think that this was a turn where he could have productively chosen a target to attack, either Italy (Vie-Tyr supported by Tri) or Russia (Vie-Boh, Trie-Vie, maybe Ser-Tri or leave it open and see waht italy does in the fall)

Fall 1904
Austria goes down the "attack Russia" path, a turn later than optimal but Russia seems to want to just turtle down.
I don't know why Italy didn't force AEG here, maybe nervous about an Austrian attack on him? Odd move by England in the fall; I'd tend to think taking LVP pays off, but maybe he's trying to keep France afloat because he sees that Germany is overruning the west?
Russia seems bound and determined to do nothing, and that seems likely to eventually cause issues (if Austria takes Silesia then Russia is in TROUBLE)

Spring 1905
Not really sure what Germany is doing here. F Den-Kiel is moving AWAY from a strong position; is he signaling supplication to Russia? Why not use Belgium to support Mun-Bur? In this case it'd have destroyed F Bur which would have been a deathblow to France i think...
Austria is now fully trusting Italy, supporting into AEG and leaving Tri open. Not a bad spot for Italy to stab if he wants in the fall.
Russia is finally moving against Turkey... after Italy has already staked a pretty strong claim to the area.

Fall 1905
I have zero clue what Germany is attempting to achieve with his fleet. He's moving closer to being a threat to STP but also leaving Denmark open. I guess he's successfully created a Den-Swe DMZ with Russia so it sort of worked?
Austria is now moving hard on Russia, while Russia didn't want to take a shot at Serbia. Russia seems to be in deep trouble here all the more so since Italy chose to vacate Venice instead of stabbing.
If Germany kept up the western offensive, G/I/A would have been the easy result i think.

Spring 1906
Germany gets predictably bounced from NTH, and retreates to HELGO for... reasons? retreating to NWG is far more powerful as an anti-England weapon, and Denmark is vulnerable as well. Germany seems to be bottling himself up for no reason that I can fathom.
Austria has taken warsaw and Russia is in serious trouble. Italy is focing units near Greece; is he stabbing Austria?

Fall 1906
Italy makes peace with Russia and Austria and now heads west. Germany builds fleets (strongly anti-England) but is bound and determined to do nothing with them. It is now obvious why England survived; Germany simply blew his advantage in the west.
Russia is bleeding units and has left Scandinavia wide open to England. Some of this is Germany's fault (presuming R/G alliance) but more is just passive Russian play eventually catching up to him. The four strongest powers are now exactly equal to the final four survivors.

Spring 1907
England's moves make plenty of sense here, but I don't really understand Germany; why bother attacking your Russian ally when it'll mainly just help England (who's clearly your enemy)?
Weirdly passive turn from Austria though.

Fall 1907
Austria gets into Livonia, which makes the Warsaw for Rumania trade fine (especially since Russia has to destroy stuff)
Not really sure why Russia is attacking ITALY here given the obvious need for peace on that front
Italy probably could have done well by supporting Mar-Spa to take a bite out of England, who's the upcoming threat in the west, but his moves were understandable at least.

Spring 1908
Russia keeps attacking Italy when Italy isn't a threat or attacking him, and Austria is both of those. Warsaw is clearly lost for Russia now.

Fall 1908
Ukr-Mos then Liv+Gal take Warsaw was the easy move for Austria, really unclear why that didn't happen
Italy has seemingly had enough of Russia's antics, and England is collapsing, i think due to fighting too many fronts at once?

Sprign 1909
Austria gets a bit lucky here, but Russia is now totally doomed
Italy is gearing up for an attack on france; probably it made more sense to run TYS/WMED and GOL-support Spa H here though.

Fall 1909
Austria finishes his huge turn. Surely he stabs a wide open Italy in 1910?

Spring 1910
Austria does indeed stab Italy. Hard to see how Italy survived it, maybe because Austria needlessly attacks Germany this turn?

Fall 1910
Austria is the main power of the game now. Smith now bored so no more comentary :P

naked
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Re: Analysis of game please

#3 Post by naked » Sat Jun 29, 2019 1:04 am

Russia: taking Rum with the fleet gives Austria a free hand to do whatever he wants. Building a fleet in 1902 in Sev is the
base of his later defeat. He needs Turkey and tanks to fight Austria.
Turkey: attacking Russia in 1901 is just awful. Turkey needs at least one partner and Russia is by far his best try, especially if Italy doesnt attack Austria.
Austria: Italy doesnt attack Austria, Russia doesnt attack Austria, Turkey attacks Russia: easy game.
Italy: if you dont wanne have the option to sneak in 1900 in Triest move your tank away. In 1902 the natural way to attack Turkey is having your fleets in Eastern Med and Ionian Sea. Austria takes Aegean Sea with his fleet. That way A + I get maximum pressure versus Turkey and Italy controls Ionean Sea all the time, for his safety and for a possible convoy of a tank to Turkey. 1905 you need a (good) plan, which connects with your position. Turkey is defeated, but that also means friends (fighting together versus Turkey) will be enemies. Your gains in Turkey are weak. Placing three units to defend two countries is bad business. Where are your next gains coming from ? At the end of the game you got lucky that England showed some skill and didnt go for your countries. That way it was an easy Draw. Just mentioning because there are a lot of awful players out there who would in Englands shoes go for Italy and most likely throw the game.
France: opening to the channel is bad. Fighting England and Germany the same time is bad, too. Tactics make a bad impression to me. After England got Spain it was an uphill battle.
England: opening to the channel is doubtful. should be no surprise that this starts a war with France. Seeing only one english fleet for this war is a surprise to me. After some lucky mess with survival a clean ending.
Germany: going to Bur in 1901 is doubtful. Fight for Bel with bad tactic. Retreat to Ruhr is possible ? Strategy overall looks bad to me. Second fleet to North Sea means Russia please take the whole Scandinavian. What wants Germany with a single fleet in North Sea ? You need more to get some gains. After some mess a clean ending.

aha195
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Re: Analysis of game please

#4 Post by aha195 » Sat Jun 29, 2019 7:23 am

Thanks lads for the response will take on the advice for future games

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Re: Analysis of game please

#5 Post by Chaqa » Sat Jun 29, 2019 7:21 pm

England here.

I believe that the only path to victory as England is to eliminate France, hence why I typically and often open to the channel. If you are bounced, France's fleet is out of position and this is much worse for France than you, as your fleet can continue to bottle up his one good port city.

Norway is almost never contested in Gunboat, so there's no reason to open double north and antagonize Russia unnecessarily. Germany is a good ally typically for England, and I believe would have remained one in this game had I not lost Liverpool (which wasn't a risk so much as me completely spacing on the possibility of an MAO -> Irish Sea move).

Ideally, I would open with my army to Wales, actually, so that I can convoy it into either Brest or Belgium. A 1901 Brest convoy is surprisingly successful in many games.

Just my 2c.

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