"The Biggest Game of All Time" - 1 year later

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swordsman3003
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"The Biggest Game of All Time" - 1 year later

#1 Post by swordsman3003 » Tue Oct 09, 2018 9:10 pm

Hello friends. As some of you may know, I wrote a massive EoG last year for a high-level gunboat game on this site.

Recently, I started a blog and converted that journal into blog posts (this was not a trivial task). I thought this might make the content a lot more accessible and might get some new readers. The process also forced me to re-read the entire journal, which was actually pretty interesting to read because in the intervening year I had forgotten a lot of what I had written down!

I love tutoring players on Diplomacy and, given the immensely positive feedback I received last year, would like to invite new readers who are interested to give it a look.

https://brotherbored.com/gunboat-diplom ... nal-intro/

WARNING: the word count total for the entire journal exceeds 80,000.

Also, while I'm at it, I'd like to thank once again all the players who participated in that game, and everyone from this website who copy-edited the journal for me.

I've also started posting some of my other Diplomacy writings on the blog, if anyone is interested.

I love Diplomacy and our community. Enjoy, my friends!
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Magnetic24
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Re: "The Biggest Game of All Time" - 1 year later

#2 Post by Magnetic24 » Tue Oct 09, 2018 11:03 pm

My friend and I read a part of the first document, and I read another section. Great document and very insightful - really puts you in the mind of a top-tier player in the (2nd) biggest game of all time. I appreciate the post and can attest to the document's greatness!

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Re: "The Biggest Game of All Time" - 1 year later

#3 Post by Durga » Wed Oct 10, 2018 2:53 am

I'm not sure if I can read this but wow. Love the effort

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Re: "The Biggest Game of All Time" - 1 year later

#4 Post by Octavious » Wed Oct 10, 2018 10:46 am

I thought I’d contribute by sharing some of my own thoughts during a typical gunboat live game. When playing gunboats I tend to do so from a comfy sofa with the TV on in the background. Here goes...



As the game started I was still thinking about an advert with crocodiles and wondering if they were real crocodiles or CGI crocodiles. Then I thought even CGI crocodiles must be based on real crocodiles to start with or maybe that’s not how that works. I glanced briefly at the board. And then the opening credits of a film came on and I wondered why the casting director always gets such a big credit right at the start, like oh wow it’s the casting director and why do they get letters after their name? And then I wondered if I knew anyone with letters after their name and eventually I remembered my ex from uni who I think is a solicitor now so she must have and then I tried to remember what she looked like and then I thought about sex. I glanced again at the board. And then the movie had started and I tried to work out who the guy who wasn’t Bill Murray was and after a while I thought maybe it was the brother out of Malcolm in the Middle but looking much older now even though it doesn’t feel like an old show and then I thought about death. I glanced again at the board and entered the orders I usually enter. And then I wondered if the mum in Malcolm in the Middle is jealous of how successful the dad in it has got. And then I remembered I used to fancy the mum in it and then I thought about sex. And then I remembered I told myself before the game that I couldn’t have another biscuit until the game had started but now it had started so I had a biscuit and then I thought about when I could have my next one and eventually I decided not until after the first phase. And then the biscuit touched the sore bit on the roof of my mouth and I thought what if it was mouth cancer. I mean it’s definitely just a toast cut but what if it was mouth cancer and then I thought about death. And then Amy Adams appeared in the film in a dressing gown and I thought about sex. And then I noticed the game had progressed into the fall phase and I was allowed another biscuit and it touched the sore place in my mouth again and I thought about death. And then…
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Re: "The Biggest Game of All Time" - 1 year later

#5 Post by Claesar » Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:51 am

Octavious wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 10:46 am
I thought I’d contribute by sharing some of my own thoughts during a typical gunboat live game. When playing gunboats I tend to do so from a comfy sofa with the TV on in the background. Here goes...
CGI crocodiles have feelings too, you know. Then again, I think this is the nicest thing you've ever said about Gunboat!

Yes, 5 minutes per phase is a lot for Gunboat. Escpecially at the start. I've found that by setting an alarm on my phone I can almost entirely prevent NMRs while watching Youtube videos..
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David E. Cohen
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Re: "The Biggest Game of All Time" - 1 year later

#6 Post by David E. Cohen » Wed Oct 10, 2018 1:47 pm

swordsman3003, I have just finished your EoG statement. Let me begin by stating that I have never played a game of Dip where I could not communicate with the other players. For me, Dip tactics are easy. The communication and psychological aspects of "regular" Dip are more challenging and more fun. Furthermore, I find the practice of draw-whittling odious in the extreme.

Now that I have gotten that off my chest, I must let you know that this is a damn good EoG statement. Well written, cogent, with good, detailed analysis and to top it off, very entertaining. I was rooting for you to solo.

Sir, I hope we may meet someday, upon the field.
[Sword drawn, sword to brow, sword down and to the side, sword sheathed]

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Re: "The Biggest Game of All Time" - 1 year later

#7 Post by Nikola Maric Eto » Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:34 pm

Love when people who didnt play gunbouts or played only a couple of them and got their asses kicked, talk about gunboat being easier, less complicated, chalenging etc. From my experience, FP games ask for less brain capabilities and less courage. In any case, what ever might be the complete truth, a player needs to play both GB and FP. That should be recognised especially because we have players that claim to be among the best, based on their rating, but if they played a couple of dozens of gunboats and live games, we will all see that they are around averidge.
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Re: "The Biggest Game of All Time" - 1 year later

#8 Post by ssorenn » Wed Oct 10, 2018 4:08 pm

Great articulate read. To be fair, gunboat is not everyone’s cup of tea. I originally thought it was a scourge as well. While still not my favorite , it does more to teach tactics then original press diplomacy.

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Re: "The Biggest Game of All Time" - 1 year later

#9 Post by David E. Cohen » Wed Oct 10, 2018 4:38 pm

Nikola Maric Eto wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:34 pm
Love when people who didnt play gunbouts or played only a couple of them and got their asses kicked, talk about gunboat being easier, less complicated, chalenging etc. From my experience, FP games ask for less brain capabilities and less courage. In any case, what ever might be the complete truth, a player needs to play both GB and FP. That should be recognised especially because we have players that claim to be among the best, based on their rating, but if they played a couple of dozens of gunboats and live games, we will all see that they are around averidge.
I did not say gunboat, per se, was easier. But with that caveat, it would likely be easier for me, for the reason that I stated, that I find small 'd' diplomacy the most challenging aspect of the game, with tactics being comparatively easy. That it is also fun is an added bonus. My Dip time is limited, so I do not intend to devote time to variants like gunboat that do not appeal to me. As far as 'courage' goes, I would like to hear more about what you mean. I suspect that it may not be applicable in my case. As a Soloist, the risk of elimination is not normally a concern for me, since I will go for any increased solo chance, if presented with an opportunity, even if elimination becomes far more likely.

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Re: "The Biggest Game of All Time" - 1 year later

#10 Post by Octavious » Wed Oct 10, 2018 7:24 pm

Nikola Maric Eto wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:34 pm
Love when people who didnt play gunbouts or played only a couple of them and got their asses kicked, talk about gunboat being easier, less complicated, chalenging etc. From my experience, FP games ask for less brain capabilities and less courage. In any case, what ever might be the complete truth, a player needs to play both GB and FP. That should be recognised especially because we have players that claim to be among the best, based on their rating, but if they played a couple of dozens of gunboats and live games, we will all see that they are around averidge.
There are many games I confess I'm not very good at. Tiddlywinks, Eton Fives, and Soggy Biscuit to name but three. Much like with gunboat, these have nothing to do with diplomacy.

I'm curious about the courage comment. It what sense does either diplomacy or gunboat require courage?

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Re: "The Biggest Game of All Time" - 1 year later

#11 Post by swordsman3003 » Thu Oct 11, 2018 1:21 pm

I suspect that the high "courage" requirement of gunboat diplomacy is that you have to leave your centers unguarded, despite not being able to make any explicit deals or gain reassurances from your neighbors.

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Re: "The Biggest Game of All Time" - 1 year later

#12 Post by David E. Cohen » Fri Oct 12, 2018 1:10 am

swordsman3003 wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 1:21 pm
I suspect that the high "courage" requirement of gunboat diplomacy is that you have to leave your centers unguarded, despite not being able to make any explicit deals or gain reassurances from your neighbors.
I don't see much of a difference between that and worrying about whether players you can communicate with will keep their word. Unless you get REALLY lucky, in order to solo a player will have to... let it all hang out, at various points in the game.

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Re: "The Biggest Game of All Time" - 1 year later

#13 Post by Nikola Maric Eto » Sat Oct 13, 2018 8:00 am

Play some gunboats and you'll "see much of a difference". :-) Until then, talks dont have a big worth.

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Re: "The Biggest Game of All Time" - 1 year later

#14 Post by David E. Cohen » Sat Oct 13, 2018 12:25 pm

Nikola Maric Eto wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 8:00 am
Play some gunboats and you'll "see much of a difference". :-) Until then, talks dont have a big worth.
Why would I willingly give up the part of the game the is the most fun to me? :-?

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Re: "The Biggest Game of All Time" - 1 year later

#15 Post by Nikola Maric Eto » Sat Oct 13, 2018 12:32 pm

In order to stop writing baseless arguments. Cheers.

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Re: "The Biggest Game of All Time" - 1 year later

#16 Post by David E. Cohen » Sat Oct 13, 2018 3:01 pm

Contrary to your opinion, I think I have a fairly good idea of what part of the game I find most enjoyable. :eyeroll: I have had quite a long time to figure it out.

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Re: "The Biggest Game of All Time" - 1 year later

#17 Post by foodcoats » Fri Oct 19, 2018 3:21 pm

Thanks for sharing this, swordsman3003. I've been looking for some good Diplomacy content since watching and re-watching all of triumvir412's Diplomacy commentaries, and there was really nothing comparable in quality until I started reading your journal. I've only just started Spring '03, but so far it's comprehensively detailed, thoughtful, well-written and beautifully formatted. Kudos!

I also have to admit that I went into reading this with an opinion similar to David E. Cohen's: I just couldn't see the diplomacy in gunboat. But now, I'm riveted to the drama of the "cold war" between you (Germany) and France, and the variety of signaling, counter-signaling and signals analysis you engage in with your neighbours. The diplomacy is almost MORE nuanced: in full-press, the whole situation would have been "figured out" and either England would be dogpiled or an EF alliance would coordinate to provide a stronger defense against GR. Without press, you have to build trust and relationship through action. It's super cool. I'm also thinking that it probably provides more opportunities for stabs, retreats and truces over the long run, since the players can't coordinate so perfectly and tunnel-vision their strategy, and everyone has to be more willing to compromise - but I guess I'll wait and see if that is how it turns out in later years.

All that to say - this inspired me to start a gunboat game. Thanks again.

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