Finished: 08 PM Thu 15 Mar 18 UTC
Private Century League W2018 T2 R2 G3
1 days, 1 hours /phase
Pot: 35 D - Autumn, 1910, Finished
Classic, Unranked, Wait for orders
1 excused missed turn
Game won by TooCoolSunday (207 D)
26 Feb 18 UTC Autumn, 1905: Dude, it sounds like you should stick to 1v1s. I don't understand why you're playing classic dip if you hate backstabbing and just want to play the tactics game. I've never seen such a carebear in my entire dip career.
26 Feb 18 UTC Autumn, 1905: You don't get to unilaterally decide how people ought to play the game. If you want to play no-backstabbing games, do 1v1s or find a group of like-minded people. I've never seen someone get so triggered from a stab.
26 Feb 18 UTC Autumn, 1905: Or chess. I like chess.
26 Feb 18 UTC Autumn, 1905: 1 stab (Austria), 2 stabs (England), 3 stabs (France in Munich), 4 stabs Turkey (in Const.), 5 stabs (Italy supporting Turkey in Const.)...
you must be very bad players, if you can only play 5 versus 1 player.
26 Feb 18 UTC Autumn, 1905: I think you've fundamentally misunderstood the entire point of this game.
26 Feb 18 UTC Autumn, 1905: Why are you playing a free-for-all game based around temporary alliances if you hate being backstabbed and you hate the idea of ganging up on people? Why have you chosen this game, out of all of the games that are much more suited to your taste?
26 Feb 18 UTC Autumn, 1905: And then you all (okay, not Italy and not Turkey at least) you make very wrong promises, although you have more armies than me.
France promises support in Munich, England promises support for Berlin, France gives wrong information about England's moves....
There is only 1 appropriate word: cowards. Honourless cowards.
26 Feb 18 UTC Autumn, 1905: (I do not include Italy and Germany in my accusation)
26 Feb 18 UTC Autumn, 1905: Is English not your first language?
26 Feb 18 UTC Autumn, 1905: "Why have you chosen this game, out of all of the games that are much more suited to your taste?"
Because I hope to find players intelligent enough to appreciate the advantages of alliances and know this is no ego shooter or suicide game, but a team game.
26 Feb 18 UTC Autumn, 1905: Appreciate the advantages of alliances?

Look at your SC count, that is what trusting people in Diplomacy gets you. That's your "advantage".
26 Feb 18 UTC Autumn, 1905: Alliances where there is mutual trust and respect are forces to be reckoned with. In this particular game, though, these things seem to be in short supply.
26 Feb 18 UTC Autumn, 1905: At the same time...an alliance in name only, when the other power is dropping centres, isn't worth it. DO you expend the energy trying to prop the other power up? It's all about advantage, or lack of it.
26 Feb 18 UTC Autumn, 1905: I agree that establishing a trusting alliance can be good, mutually beneficial play. What I don't understand is Java's moral evaluation of people who have a different play style. It's absurd. It's not a moral question.
26 Feb 18 UTC Autumn, 1905: The idea that I "lack honor" because of how I played this game is stupid af. Stabbing Russia was dumb, but it wasn't 'unethical'. I've been saying this shit to Java for basically the entire game but he's just been repeating the same shit over and over.
26 Feb 18 UTC Autumn, 1905: Well it certainly isn't moral to betray people left and right.
26 Feb 18 UTC Autumn, 1905: It's not really betrayal. We all signed up for a game of Diplomacy, we implicitly agreed that that kind of behavior is acceptable. If you want a no-stab game, then go find a no-stab game to play. It's that simple.
28 Feb 18 UTC Spring, 1906: Germany (stefanodangello), it was a pleasure to play alongside you. Sorry it didn't work out. Good luck in your 3rd game.
06 Mar 18 UTC Autumn, 1907: I'll ready in another hour or so. I have to work late some nights and I'd rather be around to chat, sorry for the delay.
06 Mar 18 UTC Spring, 1908: Do the math people. Only one person is in a position to solo and it ain't me
06 Mar 18 UTC Spring, 1908: Care bears don't solo. :) They bring their friends with them.
06 Mar 18 UTC Spring, 1908: 6 turns left?
06 Mar 18 UTC Spring, 1908: And good luck to you, Turkey (CroakandDagger).
07 Mar 18 UTC Spring, 1908: Cheers.
07 Mar 18 UTC Autumn, 1908: Ugh, good thing I put orders in. Wound up on the phone this afternoon with the local brewery that is putting one of my recipes out. So, I was excited about that...missed the diplomacy. Sorry.
09 Mar 18 UTC Autumn, 1908: Fuck you England!
09 Mar 18 UTC Autumn, 1908: Thanks for the kind words, France! Definitely a game in which I fell way short of the required commitment, but a pleasure nevertheless. Hope to play you again soon!
09 Mar 18 UTC Autumn, 1908: It is only a game.
09 Mar 18 UTC Autumn, 1908: Good luck in that third game, stefanodangello, and if there are any of us in that 3rd game, you know how to sell it.
10 Mar 18 UTC Spring, 1909: And, here we go. Down to 4 turns. Does England hold on to the lead? Does Italy jump ahead? Does France have less to hold on to that Austria. Stay tuned...
12 Mar 18 UTC Autumn, 1909: Brest, Warsaw and Sebastopol. Game.
12 Mar 18 UTC Autumn, 1909: No need. I have sneaked into Tier one, taking over from HR. I don't need a big win here even if it were possible.
I will happily take France and Russia with me to the end of the game.
Please stop sulking and accept your second place. You've played a great game and avoided all efforts to knock you into third place or below.
12 Mar 18 UTC Autumn, 1909: I'm not sulking.

People play for different reasons. I play for fun. Just surprised you aren't going for the solo.
12 Mar 18 UTC Spring, 1910: We could just draw now, that'd be pretty cool.
12 Mar 18 UTC Spring, 1910: So is this a league or a tournament? How does moving up a tier benefit anyone?
12 Mar 18 UTC Spring, 1910: It's a League. Top players go up bottom players go down. at least that's how I understand it.
13 Mar 18 UTC Spring, 1910: Ok. So the league is played in 3 game intervals?
14 Mar 18 UTC Spring, 1910: Italy seems to be a bad loser.
14 Mar 18 UTC Why do you say that?
14 Mar 18 UTC Due to his messages and insults.
14 Mar 18 UTC Of course it was a risk to trust England, but I had no choice. I offered Italy a great alliance but he thought he could destroy Russia. When I asked him to move to Armenia he denied.
14 Mar 18 UTC I don't think he had a choice over Arm, The whole narrative of the game was that I was trying to reduce his dots and you were helping. You would have had access to the Turkish centres and allowed the solo much earlier.
I'm not surprised Italy is steaming. That was a lot of effort he put into this. France too, but France realises he has to take a share of the blame for trusting me a season too far.
A bit of an EOG: I was really lucky that Germany wasn't able to give the game the attention it needed and I used Russia's trust to knock out any threat from a northern fleet fairly early. The game with France was always hard and I worked to help him, but not to let him grow. Every season was a filled with confused messages and I jumped on any uncertainty in his press not to do what he asked. France was always my target.
But everything I did to France was tempered by Italian growth. I was very happy that most saw an Italian solo as a likely outcome and some even tried to help that to come about.
It was only when the dot count for Italy started to become more difficult for him that I jumped on France. I would have liked to have waited another year, but I couldn't keep playing France any longer.
Russia is a great guy to play with, but like I said to France I am not a carebear so don't leave too many dots open to me.
Thanks all for the game, my first solo in a long time, unless I have mis-ordered. In which case i will eat humble pie for writing this too soon and giving you all a chance to mock.
Some of us are already in games with each other, and we will all meet each other again soon. I think one of the things I've learnt from this is not to take grudges from one game into the next and just play each hand as it's dealt.
Thanks everyone.
14 Mar 18 UTC Grats on the solo!
15 Mar 18 UTC Nicely done.
15 Mar 18 UTC I seem to recall you asking for end of game rationalisations a while ago, but I suspect that was just part of your "Who me? A solo?" innocent act so I don't think i'll go into as much depth as you have.

My motivation was preventing exactly this scenario, but Russia's tendency to only remember the most recent stab and their decision to keep their Black Sea fleet long after it was useful for them secured this outcome, in my view. I was a good-faith ally to Italy for much of the game, and I would have been happy for them to betray me to a solo.

If only they hadn't botched it.
15 Mar 18 UTC Congratulations, TooCoolSunday. I blame myself for your solo, and I blame my hatred (not personal, but just tactical dislike) for TheCzech from the previous game for your result. I was so focused on making sure that they didn't carry points over, that I lost sight of my own goals.

I know I was frustrated with my lack of growth, and I guess that's a lesson to me that when that starts to happen, do something about it. In this case, I'm not sure what that would have been: come to a quick agreement with italy making sure to spell out why (using a perspective that was more important to them then mine) or just launch an ill-timed/ill-fated stab regardless. The difficulty was I was so hemmed in.

We've related this over messages, but the consternation I felt when you started taking Germany's centres, without any conversation about equity or the like, should have been a reason for me to act. Instead, I bottled it up, told myself to take one for the team and you'll get yours yet, etc.

It is a game! Congratulations.

TheCzech, I'd love to play against you in gunboat sometime, if you're willing. All that "hatred" I held for you this game was actually jealousy and admiration.
16 Mar 18 UTC OK. So my EOG:
The beginning I wanted to have an IR alliance. I wanted to ally temporarily with Austria and it all seemed to be working except that France seemed to have an axe to grind. (He so admitted in his EOG. Also, thanks for the compliment) :) I managed to slip into Tri by blaming lack of time between Austria's message and the turn time. I also manegaed to get France back into French territory. It became obvious to me that England was pulling the strings in the EF alliance. I tried to reason with France that E was bad news, but it seemed he feared me more. I bullied Russia into letting me have Vie instead of letting him have it. I threatened a bounce. That's when Austria went off the chain. At this point, Russia was no longer a viable ally and I planed on killing off Austria. Turkey was the only option I had left to try and stop England from getting even further south in Russia. (I agree with Turkey that Russia NOT disbanding F in the south was a big tactical error.) Austria offered to help against England and I let him. I was going to let him keep his 2 units, but he decided to bog me down and help England. By 1908 it was obvious to me that England had the game. Russia was too keen on attacking me and leaving his centers open. I even wrote him and told him it was poor play. Since I prefer gunboat, I'm prejudiced to stop the leader. I know people play for different reasons. I read an article by Tom Sharp? (I think) about why different people play and their motives. I just couldn't figure out Russia;s motive to side with the guy who had the power to wipe him out and win. After reading his public posts I guess he just needed to believe he had an ally.

In the end, you played a GREAT game Too Cool Sunday. I could take some lessons from you.

Cheers.
16 Mar 18 UTC I think the biggest lesson I got from this game was, don't carry a grudge. It's hard, because this league scoring demands that we try to limit the leaders from previous games. I do think however, that when you suggested we work together, I couldn't separate the events of the recently ended game. How does one do that?

In the end...loved the games with you, as much as I'll bitch and complain. This was also my third game with TooCoolSunday. It's playing against folks like you that I hope to build my own Diplomacy tool box.

Good luck in your 3rd game!
16 Mar 18 UTC Good luck to you too Hamilton
16 Mar 18 UTC Good luck too all of us, except those I am currently playing against.

Start Backward Open large map Forward End

England
TooCoolSunday (207 D)
Won. Bet: 5 D, won: 5 D
19 supply-centers, 15 units
Italy
The Czech (39060 D (S))
Survived. Bet: 5 D
13 supply-centers, 14 units
France
Survived. Bet: 5 D
2 supply-centers, 3 units
Russia
Javatiger (2932 D)
Survived. Bet: 5 D
0 supply-centers, 2 units
Turkey
Defeated. Bet: 5 D
Germany
Defeated. Bet: 5 D
Austria
Defeated. Bet: 5 D
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