Finished: 01 AM Wed 29 Jan 14 UTC
Ho Ho Doom
1 day /phase
Pot: 100 D - Autumn, 2003, Finished
Modern Diplomacy II, Anonymous players, Survivors-Win Scoring
1 excused missed turn
Game drawn
19 Jan 14 UTC Spring, 2001: That's pretty amusing given that our alliance holds 33 SCs (half the board), between two players who are protecting each other's backs and moving slowly, but surely westwards. Whilst your alliance holds 28 SCs, with a number of France's forces tied up fighting Britain.

Spain, threats never work well in diplomacy, and neither do insults (which you used in your attempt to convert me to your alliance), so try to work on that ;)
19 Jan 14 UTC Spring, 2001: Still don't understand what France is doing.
19 Jan 14 UTC Spring, 2001: Probably destroying you--like I said he would :P
19 Jan 14 UTC Autumn, 2001: You also said you would help me...
19 Jan 14 UTC Autumn, 2001: Turkey can you teach me to be as cool as you please!?
19 Jan 14 UTC Autumn, 2001: England - lolz!
20 Jan 14 UTC Autumn, 2001: I did say I would help you, England--IF (big IF) you cooperated with me. I waited until you attacked me to retaliate. You attacked me, so I retaliated. Did you expect something different? Honestly?
20 Jan 14 UTC Autumn, 2001: The Duke of Liverpool will survive until the end...
20 Jan 14 UTC Autumn, 2001: nah chop off his head
20 Jan 14 UTC Autumn, 2001: Done we always listen the people's will
20 Jan 14 UTC Autumn, 2001: ooo-ray! Vive la republique
21 Jan 14 UTC Autumn, 2001: so the poor old ostrich died for nothing....
22 Jan 14 UTC Spring, 2002: hmm, why isn't Turkey voting for a draw? Can Turkey expect a better result than a draw? Maybe Turkey isn't working for Turkey in this game?... anyway definitely needs to grow a pair
22 Jan 14 UTC Spring, 2002: I'm going to suspect that Turkey's government should be in Ukrainian hands...
the situation is stalemated now that Britain is out and don't subscribe the draw is foolish...
22 Jan 14 UTC Spring, 2002: indeed, they dream of a heaven they will never see.
22 Jan 14 UTC Spring, 2002: We aren't exactly in a stalemated situation--perhaps if nobody makes any progress by Fall 2003 I'll agree to a draw.
22 Jan 14 UTC Spring, 2002: Right Ukraine you can gobble up the 13 Turkey's SCs and win...
Please explain us how do you think to conquer 13 SCs from Italy/France/Spain...
22 Jan 14 UTC Spring, 2002: I think that we've more possibilities to broke the line than you and if you don't accept quickly the draw we can refuse it in the future when you'll try it...
22 Jan 14 UTC Spring, 2002: Is that a threat?

By the way, I'm wondering (because I'm a bit new to webdip): since this is not winner-take-all, does that mean points are divided according to number of supply centers held at the end of the game? Or how are points divided? I understand in the case of a draw, that all points are divided evenly between players, regardless of SCs held.
23 Jan 14 UTC Spring, 2002: The first. Points are split depending on the number of SCs each player holds, as shown by the worth of each player down the bottom if the page.
24 Jan 14 UTC Autumn, 2002: And Ukraine is growing thanks to turkish SC...
24 Jan 14 UTC Autumn, 2002: I think you're complaining that I took Berlin... =P
24 Jan 14 UTC Autumn, 2002: Well I'm all for a holy war that eliminates ukraine then draws. Anyone else up for it?
24 Jan 14 UTC Autumn, 2002: For starters, there's no way you can attack me, Spain. I can hold my own against France and Italy. The only threat to me is Turkey, and while he does pose a threat to me, I equally pose a threat to him.
25 Jan 14 UTC Autumn, 2002: I think the real threat to ukraine and turkey is being banned for multi-ing =P
Perhaps you should draw with honour now.
25 Jan 14 UTC Autumn, 2002: Hahahahaha, multi-ing? I've never played with Ukraine before, and I am most definitely a certain entity. That should be made abundantly clear by how different our speech patterns are. Obviously, we both trust each other enough to allow armies to move through each other's territories and to give the other SCs when they have a better opportunity to expand. Spain and France, I'm sorry that you don't have that same level of trust.
25 Jan 14 UTC Autumn, 2002: I'm sorry for you that you are you.
25 Jan 14 UTC Autumn, 2002: Spain: The accusation of multi-ing is very serious. What evidence do you have that I/Turkey have been multi-ing? The fact that we've had a (fairly) well-executed alliance? It would seem to me as though your accusation is a childish attempt at forcing a draw--and I don't mean to fall for it. Being as I'm new to webDip, could someone explain to me the process for accusation of multi-ing? Is there some sort of discussion/proof of accusation? Or does a mod simply ban the "offending" players? What stops players from accusing other players simply to remove them from the game (if anything)?

Seriously: go through the game history. (Hereafter, I'll refer to the hypothetical multi-user as "I". I'll refer to myself using the usual pronouns, without quotation marks.) If "I" am multi-ing, then "I" am an incredibly stupid, dull-witted, all-round foolish Diplomacy player (that may be the case anyways, but that's unrelated to the accusation at hand). Take for example the manner in which Georgia and Rostov were taken from Russia. If "I" was multi-ing, why did I (Ukraine) sit on the fence and wait so long to help Turkey attack Russia? As you'll see by looking through the history (which I'm fairly sure you haven't done yet), my fleet in EBS was inactive for a full four turns, during which time it could have easily supported Ank-Geo (or have moved EBS-Geo with support from the Turkish units, assuming "I" was multi-ing). Why, pray tell, if "I" was multi-ing, did "I" take Rostov with Turkey? It would have benefited me (Ukraine) much more to keep Rostov so I could build a unit after taking Sweden (and FYI, I would have built a fleet in Murmansk so I wouldn't be in the position I am now against the French fleets). Either "I", as stated above, is an incredibly stupid, dull-witted, all-round foolish Diplomacy player, or you, Spain, the accuser, are. (I hesitate to stoop to name-calling, but am not above it when the opportunity is too difficult to resist.) Let us play with strategy, wisdom, and (as you yourself recommended), honour. (I noticed the Anglicized spelling, by the way. A subject of the Queen you are?)

In conclusion, I do not intend to draw this game, or at least not at the moment. Since, in a draw, the number of SCs held by surviving players is irrelevant, I propose that the weakest player, namely Italy, be eliminated from the game before suggesting a draw, as that way the pot is divided between four instead of five players.
25 Jan 14 UTC Autumn, 2002: oh look a ukranian novel.
25 Jan 14 UTC Autumn, 2002: Wow..... how childish are you Spain? Ukraine has obviously spent a lot of time and effort writing a detailed response to your accusation of multi-ing, where he's even gone into the game history to get evidence to disprove this theory. He could have spent that time doing something he'd much rather do, but instead wrote an excellent response to your accusation. Yet, you just casually brush it off, dismissively and still insult him.
25 Jan 14 UTC Autumn, 2002: lol
25 Jan 14 UTC Spring, 2003: Hello Ukraine, I haven't accused you directly of multi-ing and you probably are innocent of it. Please don't take my comments too seriously, it's all part of the fun? Certainly I don't take this game very seriously, certainly no where near as serious as you and the turk. Maybe I'm just getting old.

Anyway, you do have to wonder what on earth Turkey is doing. Control of the game is his but he seems to just want to help you win - which is a bit odd looking.

Yes I am from New Zealand, as stated in global chat earlier, and a happy subject of her majesty, though I believe she now speaks mainly in French :(
25 Jan 14 UTC Spring, 2003: I'm a Canadian myself--good to meet another subject :)
25 Jan 14 UTC Spring, 2003: And I'm an Australian. All we need is a player from India and South Africa, and we represent most of the Commonwealth :P
25 Jan 14 UTC Spring, 2003: India here
25 Jan 14 UTC Spring, 2003: Awesome! France, please say you're from South Africa :D That way we'd have all the important countries of the Commonwealth present.
26 Jan 14 UTC Spring, 2003: I'm willing to draw, but only after Italy has been eliminated (sorry, Italy). The other four of us have a vested interest in earning as many points from the pot as possible, but unless Turkey/Ukraine start fighting (which seems to be a near possibility) or France/Spain start fighting (which, in my opinion, would greatly benefit Spain, but w/e), we can all hold our positions indefinitely and nobody will get anywhere. I'm willing to support Mil-Ven from Austria and Croatia, and France, you could move Tus-Rom, Tyr S Tus-Rom, Mal H or Mal S Apu-Nap, and Turkey could take Naples from Apulia and Ionian. The only reason for Italy to still be in the game is because of mutual distrust--can we please work together, even if only for one turn, to eliminate Italy?
26 Jan 14 UTC Spring, 2003: A simple answer: no! Ukraine if you want a 4 way draw you must eliminate Turkey...
27 Jan 14 UTC Spring, 2003: A complicated answer: The points are not significant to me. Two results are acceptable: a draw or win. The latter is unlikely. I don't care how many I draw with.
I like Italy, Italy has survived against the odds. Ukraine I think it is hypocrisy to expect us to betray Italy when you refuse to do anything about turkey.
27 Jan 14 UTC The reason I ask to eliminate Italy as opposed to Spain, myself, France or Turkey is simple: none of us can be eliminated in one turn. But Italy can be.
27 Jan 14 UTC Understood, but it's a no from Spain and France, so maybe if you ask Italy really nicely...
27 Jan 14 UTC Sorry Ukraine, but that's not happening. I realize I can be eliminated really easily, but as long as Spain and France are happy to let me survive, i intend to hang on.
27 Jan 14 UTC Okay, then I agree to a draw.
27 Jan 14 UTC None of us can get anywhere. Even with France's army in Lapland, I can still hold Sweden because I now have a fleet in the Baltic Sea. Unless one of us breaks our current alliance, none of us can get anywhere. I had thought I could convince someone to get too greedy--but apparently not :) My mistake, sorry for wasting your time.
27 Jan 14 UTC Thanks Ukraine. We appreciate your dedication to the game :) You are known in Espana as the legendary 'Grey Wolf of the East'. True story.
28 Jan 14 UTC Agh. Too bad I messed up my moves several times... I think I may have been able to win otherwise :( Ach well. It was a fun game, and we all earned points.
28 Jan 14 UTC gg thanks all
28 Jan 14 UTC gg thanks all
28 Jan 14 UTC Good game I hope to meet you again...!!!
28 Jan 14 UTC GGWP

Start Backward Open large map Forward End

Ukraine
joshuavoskamp (480 D)
Drawn. Bet: 10 D, won: 20 D
23 supply-centers, 21 units
France
Ayreon (3398 D)
Drawn. Bet: 10 D, won: 20 D
18 supply-centers, 18 units
Turkey
Ar Jack (1630 D)
Drawn. Bet: 10 D, won: 20 D
12 supply-centers, 12 units
Spain
fiedler (1293 D)
Drawn. Bet: 10 D, won: 20 D
8 supply-centers, 8 units
Italy
protyasha (190 D)
Drawn. Bet: 10 D, won: 20 D
3 supply-centers, 3 units
Britain
wiler5002 (100 D)
Defeated. Bet: 10 D
Egypt
hobomonkey (124 D)
Defeated. Bet: 10 D
Germany
LordRomulus (100 D)
Defeated. Bet: 10 D
Poland
Arcsius (136 D)
Defeated. Bet: 10 D
Russia
andre72 (100 D)
Defeated. Bet: 10 D
Civil Disorders
hobomonkey (124 D)Egypt (Autumn, 1998) with 0 centres.
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